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Do all 2002 have the 235 HP engine

11K views 55 replies 14 participants last post by  rotket  
#1 ·
I'm looking at buying a 2002 ram 2500 cummins. In my research (wikipedia which can be wrong) it states the 2nd gen is from 1998.5 - 2002 and the 3rd gen is from 2002 - 2009. If that is true was it that they offered the 2nd gen in the first half of 2002 and the 3rd in second half? In any case, how do I know if the 2002 I'm looking to buy is 2nd gen or 3rd.

This is important to me because, again correct me if I'm wrong, but the 2nd gen only had a 235 hp engine (245 hp with the high output version). And the 3rd gen has a 250 hp (and 305 or something in the HO version).

So, bottom line question how do I find out which engine this 2002 has in it?

Thanks.
 
#2 ·
Easiest way to know is the body style. 3rd gens look different

3rd Gen ( has cp3 injeciton pump and ( 250/305 hp)


2nd Gen ( has vp44 injection pump and 235/245 hp)


You can look at the engine sticker to see what it is rated at, but really it shouldn't matter....

stock 2nd gens are SLOW regardless.....really so are stock 3rd gens.

If you are looking at HP numbers then you will likely be modding...which then means it doesn't matter really what you start with ( unless you want over 700 hp)
 
#3 ·
if its a 2002, its a second gen. auto and 5 speed manual have to 235hp engine, the 6 speed manuals came with the 245hp HO.
 
#4 ·
vin code would be 7 instead of 6 if it's a manual/HO... vin code 7 245hp/505trq vin code 6 235/435

2003 changed the HEAVY DUTY cummins body style and it's NOT the one pictured in the reply above.
the original reply poster is confused..

2002 body style changed for the base 1500 models not 2-3500...
 
#6 ·
Dont use sources like Wikipedia. :doh: Look at places like here Fritz's Dodge Ram Tech. Lots of good accurate info..... :thumbsup:
 
#7 ·
OK, so the body style is definitely the 2nd gen, also it has the 6-speed manual, does that mean that it is definitely the HO (245 HP) engine?

Was really hoping it had the higher power of the 3rd gen, we are making this into a fire/brush truck and it will be hauling a 3000 lbs load on the bed, and going up steap hills in 4 wheel drive. yes I know we need to beef up the suspension. But do you think the 245 HP engine can handle that?

Are there straightforward mods (not expensive or complicated mechanically) to increase the HP a bit?

Also, we're looking at the cummins because it has a reputation for reliability, is that true for this year, and 2nd gen in general? There are some nice Duramax and 7.3 powerstroke out there for the same money. I know this is a cummins forum but are they really that much better?

Greatly appreciate the advice, we are buying soon and dropping $15k into this so we want to make the right choice.
 
#9 ·
Giving us the full and complete details on what truck you're looking at may help with suggestions since there is always "something" to look out for.

Other than that and in regards your questions.....
Yes, that is the HO motor. But dont get hung up on such small technicalities either because the SO motor is sometimes the desired motor for power adding reasons. And good news is you're not looking at an auto tranny truck since the manual tranny trucks are essentially a SRW 1 ton truck.

And 3000 lbs in the bed is going to be a lot for most all trucks. Even for a DRW truck. And in saying that, the 3rd gen trucks have softer suspension which tend to not carry as heavy of loads stable as the 2nd gen trucks. But..... 3000 lbs will most likely justify the need for some sort of suspension help even with the factory overloads. That being in the form of airbags or Timbrens. I like my Timbrens and they're only a couple hundred dollars.

Do I think the 245 hp Cummins can handle 3000 lbs going up hill????? That 6 speed manual tranny Cummins could "idle" up that hill without breaking a sweat. Thats being totally serious too as these engines actually produce 300 foot lbs of torque at idle, so.....yes it could truly idle up that hill. Seriously though, I'm not sure any truck couldn't handle driving up hill with 3000 lbs in the bed. But if you ever feel like dragging 20k + lbs up that hill and then you would definitely NEED a Cummins.

Are there any straightforward mods? Yes, you can add a mild timing box like the Edge EZ which will add 60 hp / 180 lb torque.....to the ground. To put that "mild" power increase in perspective, most gasoline engine chips add around 1/4 that to the crank. This is absolutely why diesels have become increasingly popular with the hotrod crowds.

Cummins is well known for reputation for reliability too. The 2nd gen trucks are still very desired because the cheap and easy power you can crank out of them is something the newer trucks cant offer relative to the costs and ease. Plus with emissions and diesel smog laws bearing down on the diesel community faster than we'd hope, the 2nd gen 24 valve trucks are pretty much legally exempt from anything you change or add except for timing/fueling boxes (which are easily removed before inspection) or overly larger injectors which would make them smoke too much during inspection.

The only reliability issues the 2nd gens have is the fuel system. Aftermarket fuel pumps and usually replacement fuel injection pumps are in order at some time or another. Still though, both of those items are cheaper and easy than that of similar items on the newer trucks. Again, this is why the 2nd gens are popular.

But all that said, $15k is not cheap so you must be looking at a really nice truck. :thumbsup:
 
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#8 ·
engine wise...the cummins out rates all others (hands down) the inline design shines for torque...which is what you need.

the rest of the dodge shell, is a different story. do you homework, to make sure the rest of the truck is what you want....especially going this old.
 
#10 ·
I have nothing to add to this thread besides saying that katoom... you always have well thought out and very informative posts.
Keep it up!
 
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#11 ·
Look for a sticker on the side of the valve cover on the driver side.
 
#14 ·
If you can get one with a good history and mechanical standing you should be more than able to get one for 10k. Good luck on your search.
 
#15 ·
I know what your talking about here is my Engine 11 which is a Ford F450 chassis and holds 400 gallons of water.
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As for the Dodge Cummins it will haul nearly anything you put in the bed. Of course you want to to do it safely too so consider the dually still because the tires are your limit unless you get Load Range G's (3,750 pounds @ 110 PSI) which are kind of spendy.
 
#17 ·
I think the only reason the dodge manual transmissions were so good is because dodge didn't build them. We all have seen how well they can build a auto.
 
#18 ·
Well as for our Fire Dept we've got both a Ford F550 6.0L and a Ford F450 7.3L. Both are automatics. I will say both Ford are extremely tough starting cold. You might try 1-3 times at 40-50*F shed temperatures. Both are extremely weak for pulling weight up hills being a auto. Lot of rev but little go. I cringe every time the fire chief gets up against hill banks or steep mountain face. You can stand on the throttle lots of rev but little go. The 6.0L has blown 2 EGR coolers already. The 7.3L is a good rig but limited to 65-70 MPH tops near right at governed speed.

My suggestion if you do anything make it a manual transmission. Katoom suggest the exhaust brake. I second the the suggestion too. You'll be surprised how much weight and how little hold back you got so exhaust brake is a must. Out than that you better have a good maintenance schedule for brakes.

Funny part is the Fire Chief has both a 5.9L CR and 6.7L CR Cummins and both have more power than either Ford. His 6.7L has the exhaust brake function. Like myself I'm also a 5.9L VP44 Cummins and no issues starting even in the coldest winters. Exhaust brake here too. Ford are the most popular truck because of over glorified cargo capacity numbers and cheap price compared to GM or Dodge. Take notice though if you work a USFS fire USFS uses mostly Ford's but private contractors tend to use more Dodge's.

I wouldn't mind to have that Dodge for Fire Fighting...:thumbsup: Better than the Chief's F550 Ford 6.0L...
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(Tepee Springs Fire, Idaho - Near Partridge Creek on the Big Salmon River)
 
#19 ·
Yes.....run away from any Ford 6.0 trucks. NOT a good engine and very expensive to work on. :doh:
 
#20 ·
Id stick to 5.9, 7.3, and maybe if I had to a 6.6.
 
#21 ·
Here is what we've decided on choosing from:

99 or newer Ram Cummins with 6-speed manual

01 to 03 f-250/350 7.3 PSD with 6-speed manual. The 6.0's are a dime a dozen on craigslist but I won't go there.

05 and newer chevy/GMC Duramax with the 6-speed Allison automatic. I've read the LB7 Duramax had real issues with the injectors.

I'm seeing about a half dozen 99 - 02 Cummins with the 6-speed but with miles north of 200k, some around 250. Would it be advisable to not buy a truck with that many miles? I know less miles is always better, and if the truck was really well maintained that many miles is nothing, but.... It is probably hard to really know if a 250k truck is going to have problems.

Would I be better off (all things being equal) with a 250k miles cummins over a 200k miles duramax?
 
#23 ·
OK, a 99 6-speed is not the HO engine. Not a big deal but just pointing out that the 6-speed was introduced with the SO motor and the same input shaft and clutch as the 5-speed. In 2001 the input shaft and clutch diameter was increased and only available mated to the HO motor. SO motors were 5-speeds. Again, small technicalities not worth bothering with since you simply want a manual for what you're doing. That being a 5 or 6 speed.

Dont know about what years 7.3 is better or not and yes, the 6.0 is HORRIBLE and why they're so cheap.

Dont fret a Cummins with 200-300 thousand miles. That nothing for this engine and yes, as long as the rest of the truck is in good shape then its likely that the maintenance was good.

And yes, I'd much rather have a 200k Cummins than a 200k Duramax. Thats not a knock on Duramax either but just that the Cummins is tried and true over and over. :thumbsup:
 
#22 ·
When the odometer shows this then it might a good time to walk away... (No they do not roll over it stays all 9's forever!) Everything else is low miles. Cummins 12V or 24V is good for at least million miles been done quite a bit by hotshotters. CR Engines I would be a bit more weary about mileage being most die around 200-300k miles from bad injectors.

Like old CajFlynn's truck here end its life at 1.3 Million miles in a traffic accident.
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#24 ·
Food for thought.

You see Ford and Chevy owners yanking out there engines and putting a Cummins in. Now that being said you don't see any conversion kits for putting a Duramax or International in a Dodge Body. There is Allison Transmission conversion kits for Dodge. So just look at what everyone uses for conversion there is a reason for it because "It Works"!

Destroked - THE Cummins Conversion Company : Home Page

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#25 ·
I know you were asking about weight carrying ability, and I can just say from personal experience that I carry 3,000 lbs. of truck camper many times per year, hundreds of miles per trip. I've even carried well over 4,000 lbs. on a 15 mile haul.

Only suspension modifications are Rancho 9000 adjustable shocks and Maxx sway bar links.

My local fire department used a 1st Gen 4x4 Dodge up until last year as a brush fire rig.
 
#26 ·
With that much weight it would be best to stick with Dually if you can. If not airbags or something . Regular cabs haul more than Quad cabs. Trani's do not matter much in that you always have low range but the 6 speed will have better crawling with out slipping like the auto can.If you can afford it you could go a third gen 550 chassis cab. It will haul a lot more. Unless you got one from the coast the bodies are fine in CA, no rust. Any engine is fine. 600k on mine. Check suspension. Alternators must be watched for AC noise.

I sold them for 15 years and live near Colusa if you want to talk.
 
#28 ·
If you go with the auto option for a 2nd gen look at beefing the trans up. Hauling all the tools you will need will likely be the death of it if you don't have it beefed up. The best thing to do would be to find you one that meets your dept expectations and go from there. We won't be able to fit your needs.
 
#29 ·
This is good to know. Maybe not a big deal but I'd like to stick with a 6 sp and the HO engine if I can.
Nothing really to gain with a 6 speed. The extra gear was insert down low.
https://highgeartransmission.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/gear-ratios.jpg?w=951

NV4500 5th - 0.75
NV5600 6th - 0.73

NV 4500 4th - 1:1
NV 5600 5th -1:1

Basically slip in between 3rd and 4th on a 5 speed. on my truck I'd be at 25 MPH in 3rd gear on my NV4500. As for 5th gear nut problems as long as you keep the fluid changed, no oversized tires, etc. you should be fine. I'm at 253k miles and still going no issues. Even heavy hauling and towing most of the truck life.
 
#30 ·
Katoom's post was the best response as to the power characteristics of these trucks, and I think you're spending way too much time focusing on horsepower, as most people new to diesel's usually do.

Horsepower is a number that is computed from torque at a given RPM. Because of the forumula used, torque and horsepower always cross at 5252 rpm's. That is why 235 diesel HP is in no way comparable to 235 gasoline horsepower. The gas engine is probably running 5,500 RPM's to get that horsepower. How long do you think it would last turning at 5,500 RPM's? Our diesels produce in the neighborhood of 300ft.lbs of torque near idle. That's a completely different ballgame.

Even an abused '89 first gen automatic with 800,000 miles on it would have more than enough power for what you're wanting to do.
 
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#32 ·
Regular cab 3500 will carry almost twice as much weight as Quad cab 2500. As long as it has no starting problems after sitting, 266k is fine.

If you are still looking watch Auto/truck trader and cars.com.
 
#33 ·
We've got it narrowed down to these 6:

02 Ram 3500 single cab flatbed 6 sp man 4x4 266k miles - $10k

07 Ram 3500 single cab flatbed 6 sp man 4x4 257k miles - $13.5
Newer model (3rd gen) 6.7 350hp engine. Not sure it is worth the extra money?

99 Ram 3500 single cab flatbed 5 sp man 4x4 312K miles - $7000
Cheap but lot-o-miles and a little beat up.

01 Ram 2500 single cab flatbed 4 sp auto 4x4 190k miles - $8000
rather have the manual but not many choices - this has 47RH-RE is this a good tranny?

01 Ram 2500 extra cab longbed 5 sp man 4x4 171k miles - 12.9

05 Chevy silverado 2500 single cab long bed 4 sp auto 4x4 160k - $8500
Probably not much support on this board for the Duramax but it seems like a good deal. Wish it was the 6sp allison but that was not available until 07
 
#34 ·
Make sure to check for 53 blocks on those 01's. Unlikely with that mileage but not out of the question.