I have repalced the wiring as well, and am still having issues....

Getting P2121, P2122 DTC's? Dead pedal?

By "replaced the wiring", have you installed the Timbo direct wiring repair harness for the under battery Apps?

Timbo Apps wiring harness: Blank


If you have installed the Timbo harness, then you would need the wiring diagram for both the 2004.5 and the 2005 trucks.
There are very few differences, electrically between these trucks. Same engine, same ECU, etc.
The only differences I can think of is the pedal APPS and the in-tank fuel pump.
And possible auto trans differences which doesn't apply to a manual trans truck with the under battery APPS,

 

Manual or automatic?

Super easy if manual. Kinda hard and expensive if automatic.

 

Only the manual trucks ever had the APPS mounted under the driver's side battery.

If you have some info on this swap, please share it when you get a chance.

My 2004.5 manual trans truck with the APPS under the battery, throws a P2121 Apps voltage DTC about once a year.
No dead pedal when it occurs. I just clear the code and carry on for about another year.
I have reseated the 2 ECM connectors a few times to see if that helps.

 

That’s what I thought, but never have dealt with a manual so I wanted to be sure.

You guys don’t have a vacuum servo for cruise, correct?

If so, looks like you guys could easily go to the 05 APPS then.

This is the pinout for under battery APPS

Here is pinout for 05 pedal APPS

 

Awesome! Thanks for the info. This helps tremendously!

 

If you can’t find the plug for the pedal apps, order part 68040448ab from chrysler. That is the kit that contains the receptacle and wires with gold contacts for the 05-06 pedal apps.

But to be honest, those kits are overpriced. I really just recommend going to a local pick and pull and cutting the harness with the whole pedal. Also, afaik newer 07.5+ apps mount differently and have a different plug with different pinout, but the output voltages are the same. I have a 2016 apps in my truck and it goes perfectly with the 07.0 ecm.

Remember to solder those connections!

Good luck!

 

Thanks very much for the info CumminsTurboFreak.
The wiring looks straightforward. Both Apps have logically compatible 6 pin connections.

Getting rid of the problematic under battery APPS would be a huge benefit.
Getting a used pedal Apps assembly and harness would be cheap. Cheaper than the pricey Timbo APPS repair harness which may or may not fix the issue.

I will be hunting for a 2005-06 Ram Hemi for the pedal Apps and wiring assembly at my local autowrecker.
There are tons of 1/2 ton Rams, a few 3/4 ton Hemi's but zero Cummins Rams.

Just thinking out loud, one could cut the required wires at the ECM connectors, run and extend the wires from the pedal Apps and then join them to the cut ECM wires.
I wonder how the factory ran the wires from the APPS pedal to the ECM on the 2005 and up trucks?

If the swap didn't work, you could splice the original APPS wires to the cut ECM wires, or then use the Timbo APPS repair harness.

 

Factory has the APPS wiring running through the PDC to dash harness. It specifically runs from the engine harness through the big connector near the brake reservoir and splits off inside the cab shortly after the big harness grommet.

 

Made this a Sticky.
There will be more members needing this info as time passes.

 

That’s cool. We just need confirmation from stealth or Jules that it works correctly.

 

I did a quick run thru at our local pickn'pull auto wrecker today at lunch.

They had over a dozen 2002-06 Ram 1500 Hemi's there.
ALL were cable throttle. Not one had the pedal/Apps assembly.


An on-line search shows that P/n 53032794AB is the needed 2005-06 pedal/Apps assembly needed.

2005-2006 Dodge Accelerator Pedal 53032794AB | Mopar Online Parts

2005-2006 Dodge Part # 53032794AB - Accelerator Pedal

parts.moparonlineparts.com

This link also shows fitment for every RAM made 2005-06.
I'm missing something here.

 

...

Cheers

 

Nice work and update, thanks Jules.

Standard products used to be good quality, made in the USA. Hopefully they still are.

Standard pedal and APPS assemby #APS312. Approx US$200.
Standard pigtail connector #S2082. Approx US$50.

This should be a one time fix. You never hear of pedal APPS issues, unlike the engine bay APPS systems.
Plus you get rid of the hard to access under battery Apps and the pedal cable to it.
Plus much cheaper than the obsolete under battery Apps.

At this point my truck throws an APPS DTC once a year, with no dead pedal but if the issue gets worse the pedal Apps swap will be my plan.
I will still keep an eye out at my local autowreckers for the pedal Apps assembly, pigtail and bracket.

 

FWIW, I’m pretty sure you can also use a 2007-2018 pedal as well. They do use a different plug and pinout. They also mount differently, but this doesn’t matter since you already need to source a fixed mounting bracket or adjustable mounting bracket.

I can provide the connector pinout for that one if you want.

I actually mounted the entire 2016 pedal box in my truck, APPS and everything. I did it because I found a killer deal on the whole assembly, and the newer style adjustable mechanism wobbles substantially less than the original.

 

So I did find a 2005 2500 Hemi auto trans APPS pedal assembly in the wreckers.

The bracket, entire pedal/sensor assembly and the pigtail. Cad$7.99!
I never could find an Apps pedal assembly in any 2005/06 1500 truck. Maybe a Canadian thing?

The assembly has p/n 53032753AC on it which subs to 53032794AB as posted above.

2005-2006 Dodge Accelerator Pedal 53032794AB | Mopar Online Parts

2005-2006 Dodge Part # 53032794AB - Accelerator Pedal

parts.moparonlineparts.com

So the bracket holding the pedal assembly to the firewall/pedal box is different but it looks like it will bolt in.
I don't have the adjustable pedals in my truck, but Jules mentioned he had to mod the bracket to make it fit.
I don't think the Standard APPS pedal assembly came with the bracket so perhaps he modded the existing bracket.

I may have to try removing my existing pedal assembly and trying the APPS pedal assembly to see if it bolts in.


I should point out that I haven't had an Apps issue or DTC in my truck in over 3 months, so no plan to install this at this time.
But I like to be prepared with the proper solution when it's needed.


Pics of the used 2005 2500 Hemi auto trans Apps pedal assembly:

 

I would just get it done and over with when you have time and a 6 pack lol.

Nothing worse then getting stuck somewhere because APPS decided to quit...

 

Just curious to see how the swaps are doing? My apps codes only happen when I use cruise control lol, I just want to be able to let off the pedal and chill

 

So you have the APPS mounted under the driver's side battery?
Post up more info on your truck. Exactly what DTC's? Any symptoms?

 

So your other threads on this issue confirm that you do have an under battery APPS and that you also have a BD exhaust brake that taps into the APPS.
And you are getting several APPS DTC's and serious APPS failure symptoms.

Strange coincidence as I also have a BD exhaust brake that taps into the APPS.

I wonder if OP, Jules, also has a BD exhaust brake?


On the older trucks the BD exhaust brake used an adjustable APPS module "trigger". It's a high impedence voltage sensor that is monitoring one of the APPS signals to trigger the ex brake.
I tapped into the APPS wire near the driver's side battery, T'd in, soldered and heatshrink.

I get an APPS P2121 about once a year on my 2004.5. No symptoms, just a ding and CEL/DTC that I clear with my Smarty.
It happens so rarely in my truck that I don't recall what the conditions are when the APPS DTC is set.

Instead of removing your BD ex brake, I would disable the BD APPS module and just run the exhaust brake on the master switch manually.
Most guys run their exhaust brake manually with a switch on the gearshift shaft.
This would eliminate the BD ex brake APPS module.

Then I would be shopping your local autowreckers for a 2005-06 1500/2500/3500 truck and remove the pedal APPS sensor, bracket and pigtail as I did above.

 

So your other threads on this issue confirm that you do have an under battery APPS and that you also have a BD exhaust brake that taps into the APPS.
And you are getting several APPS DTC's and serious APPS failure symptoms.

Strange coincidence as I also have a BD exhaust brake that taps into the APPS.

I wonder if OP, Jules, also has a BD exhaust brake?


On the older trucks the BD exhaust brake used an adjustable APPS module "trigger". It's a high impedence voltage sensor that is monitoring one of the APPS signals to trigger the ex brake.
I tapped into the APPS wire near the driver's side battery, T'd in, soldered and heatshrink.

I get an APPS P2121 about once a year on my 2004.5. No symptoms, just a ding and CEL/DTC that I clear with my Smarty.
It happens so rarely in my truck that I don't recall what the conditions are when the APPS DTC is set.

Instead of removing your BD ex brake, I would disable the BD APPS module and just run the exhaust brake on the master switch manually.
Most guys run their exhaust brake manually with a switch on the gearshift shaft.
This would eliminate the BD ex brake APPS module.

Then I would be shopping your local autowreckers for a 2005-06 1500/2500/3500 truck and remove the pedal APPS sensor, bracket and pigtail as I did above.

I’ve gotten a p2121 p2122 and I think a p0222 or something like that one time, I get dead pedal, or recently it’s actually been I can only get 1/4-1/2 throttle out of it then it starts bogging and missing, that only will last the remainder of the drive then it is fine on next startup, like I said I could never get the brake to work so I took it off anyway, but the problem only happens when I use cruise control since I got rid of the brake, the brake was tapped into a yellow wire right off the ecm plug, and two wires under the steering wheel,04.5 manual transmission 325hp

 

I would never run my truck without an exhaust brake but perhaps you don't tow that often.

I had forgotten that the BD exhaust brake also taps into the cruise control wires to disable cruise control when you activate the ex brake.
This is an excellent feature but could cause APPS issues. I've had the BD ex brake on my truck for over 14 years.
It's the in-line brake and I added a clutch switch to the circuit when I installed it.
Only a few issues with the ex brake over the years. A few air leaks and a failed air regulator.

But since you have removed your BD ex brake, that is not causing the issue.

The cruise control, with the under battery APPS, is integrated into the ECM. There is no separate vacuum motor or electric motor or anything else.


I recommend to start shopping for a good used pedal APPS assembly. Or you could just purchase the pedal and pigtail from Chrysler or a 3rd party supplier and fab up a bracket as Jules did.

You could try the Timbo APPS direct harness but it's pricey at US$100 plus no guarantee it will resolve the issue.

Blank

 

Hey all,

I’ve been dealing with a lot of mid 90s Mercedes cars recently. Seen quite a few at the salvage yard too

It seems some R129 and W140 cars use almost the same throttle sensor as the 2004.5 trucks. The connector is different. I wonder if the Mercedes pigtail is wired in it would work with the 04.5 trucks...

 

So does anyone have a pic or pics of the new pedal apps mounted into a truck with adjustable pedals? Looking to see how it's done. I'm not having issues with codes but I can't stand how tough the throttle is on my truck. Push on it and sometimes and certain spots it's laggy then goes like a raped ape. Looking at a 05 pedal from a guy near me. Btw this is on an 03 3500

 

So the 2003 truck has a manual trans with the Apps under the battery?

I have test fit the 2005 Apps/pedal assembly in my 2004.5 with non-adjustable pedals and it bolts right in.

Part number research on the 2003 accelerator pedal assembly versus a 2004.5 pedal assembly versus adjustable pedal assembly would get you the answer for your question.

 

…Or anyone can do what I did and buy the entire 2010-2018 pedal box with adjustable pedals for $80 on eBay… It bolts right in.

The newer adjustable pedals are a better design. The 04 adjustable brake pedal used to wobble so much…

 

Yes. Very easy.

Then unbolt brake master from inside and pull out, and unbolt box itself and pull out.

Only need to swap plug on motor…

By chance do u have a link to one that will work?

 

How hard is it to swap those pedal boxes? Steering wheel shafts need to come out?

 

Yes. Very easy.

Then unbolt brake master from inside and pull out, and unbolt box itself and pull out.

Only need to swap plug on motor…

 

This worked for my truck! thanks for the help folks!

 

I'm looking for the 03 and 07 wiring schematics as I found a pedal from an 07 hemi. Looks as though it may bolt right up to my 03. Getting that and the harness for $30

 

No idea here but I wouldn't doubt if all the pinouts are close to the same, not sure if you an guess and chek

 

Thank you. My truck was a manual so it has the under battery apps. That's the other one I will need. Hopefully someone will beable to find those schematics. Just curious where u get the ones you posted?

 

Connectors.dcctools.com

 

Alright guys, I'm in some unfamiliar territory here with the APPS system other than it's basic function.
I'll try to give as much info as I can. 04.5 manual, APPS would be under the battery tray.

It's been REALLY raining out here in the PNW. Lots of moisture in the air and we've gotten torrential downpours resulting in multiple inches of rain over the last couple weeks.

Truck had been sitting for a few days, fired it up to go do some things. Nothing seemed out of the ordinary. Truck threw a check engine light, P2122, APPS low voltage. Truck drove fine, no issues. Clear the code. Good for a couple days. Yesterday I fire up the truck, running around, EB is on to keep everything moving, as soon as I release the skinny pedal, I see the check engine light come on. I knew it was the same thing. This time though, when I pressed the gas to go (the EB should normally cut off), the EB didn't cut off. So it wasn't responding to the pedal depression...it had a moment of being "dead". This was at about 30 mph. So I cut the EB with my switch and pulled over into a parking lot, read the code (same) cleared it, went on my way. Turned the EB back on for the rest of the day and what I was doing, it functioned as it should, no codes thrown. It has been fine since then into today, but I suspect it will come back again.

Ok. I start searching the hundreds of threads, they make my head spin, do some more research and land here. Note, this is the first time in my ownership of the truck that I've had a check engine light (since 2012). In that time, I've had a PacBrake installed for its entirety, with no issues. It's tapped into what I think would be an aAPPS wire (PO put it on) since it automatically turns off when you hit the skinny pedal (I also have a switch on the stick).

So first things first. I need to ensure that my unit under the battery tray is good.
I found this in my search:

Timbo's Site

There's a video at the bottom that says you need 2X multimeters and you need to bench test it by applying 5V and taking readings, making sure that one of the voltages is double the other. If that checks out, the unit is good, and it's likely the harness.

So first question...can this be tested on the truck? I don't have a 5V source for the bench. Is there a decent writeup for testing the APPS unit under the battery or can that even be done? Also does it still require 2x multimeters or is there a test that can utilize 1?

Second, in that link, that harness Timbo makes, from reading, goes directly to the ECM and cuts out the other wiring (wherever it goes, I'm unclear of that right now). Is this the best solution if you want to keep the under tray APPS in tact? If so now I'd think there are a bunch of dead wires in the harness, which means where my EB is sensing pedal depression I'm assuming won't work anymore unless I splice off Timbo's harness (If I would choose to even do that)?

Third...do I ditch everything above and go with the pedal mount APPS? I'm kind of confused about which pedal assy bolts right up. I'd like to try to avoid fabbing a custom bracket, so I'm a bit unclear of what I should be looking for (ebay, salvage yard, etc). Also, If I go this route, if I understand correctly, you basically build a harness that goes from the OEM plug position and run it into the cab and splice into the connector for the pedal mounted APPS? If that's the case, it doesn't solve the problem of a bad harness does it? Or am I misunderstanding and we would actually build a harness like Timbo's that runs into the cab and taps directly into the ECM?

Sorry for all the questions, but it seems a few of you guys have done this before.