[mcramer15]

I am planning on either making a goose neck hitch or buying one. I would rather make it and this is what I came up with this morning. I have a 2004 Dodge Ram 3500 and there is no holes in the frame for mounting it so I would have to drill them out. I don't like having to drill into the frame but if I did would you put a tube through the hole and weld it in or is that not necessary? I am not currently done with the design but I would like to be able to get a BW ball and make a mechanism similar to theirs so I could "flip" the ball.

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[kblranch]

I have the BW and it requires that no holes be drilled in the frame. Why reinvent the wheel? Great factory support and already engineered.

 

[mcramer15]

I have the BW and it requires that no holes be drilled in the frame. Why reinvent the wheel? Great factory support and already engineered.

On a 2004? I looked at the frame today and there wasnt any holes in the frame that is in the axle area. Or does it use U-bolts to tie it to the frame? I reinvent it to make it cheaper. From the searching I have done they cost $400+ and I could probably make it for less then 150...

 

[kblranch]

u - bolts are your friend.

 

[mcramer15]

What keeps it shifting on the frame?

 

[Ram3500Dually]

Read up on the hydro-formed frame before you go drilling and welding on it....

 

[mcramer15]

Read up on the hydro-formed frame before you go drilling and welding on it....

So what is so special about a hydro formed frame? Its just a different way they form the steel.... unless I haven't done enough reading?.....

Please enlighten me.

 

[Ram3500Dually]

A hydro formed frame is brittle. There are only certain places you can drill on them and you aren't supposed to weld on them.

 

[mcramer15]

Idk....

TSB 13-001-03

HOLES:
Holes are not to be drilled in the top or bottom of the frame rails. Holes to mount outriggers, brackets, and supports must be drilled in the web (vertical sides) of the frame rail with the following restrictions:

Hole diameter should not exceed 20mm (0.75 in.).
Material between edge of hole and top or bottom of frame rail must not be less than 40mm (1 .60 in.).
The minimum edge distance between any two (2) holes must be larger than twice the diameter of the larger hole.
Any through frame fasteners that torque down on both external surfaces of the frame rail must use an Internal spacer/reinforcement to prevent crushing the rail tube.
All holes should be drilled In the frame using appropriate safety precautions.
Avoid drilling holes near the fuel tank, fuel and brake lines and other lines and wires to avoid damage to them.
WELDING:
Prior to welding, the following must he done.

Avoid welding near,the fuel tank, fuel and brake lines or other components that may be damaged by the heat of welding, If R is necessary to remove the fuel tank, lines or other components, do it In accordance with applicable service manual procedure.
Components near the welding area which could be damaged by excessive heat must be removed or adequately shielded.
Disconnect the battery(ies)
Precautionary measures should be used to prevent electrical system components or wiring damage.
Frame E-coating must be removed from the weld area prior to welding. Use proper welding techniques to avoid stress risers that may adversely affect frame performance.
AFTER WELDING:

Carefully inspect electrical components and wiring for shorts or other damage.
Apply an anti corrosion protective coating to the areas where the coating was removed.

 

[Ram3500Dually]

Here are a few excerps from different sites

the new trucks have a "Hydro-formed" frame. This is a manufacturing technique that was first used by large truck frame manufacturers, then General Motors used this process in the C-5 Corvette introduced in 1997. The manufacturer's claim is that it improves structural rigidity, requires fewer welds, and just overall enhances the chassis tuning. Like it or not, this is the way frames are made today.

Well here's a tip. Do not, repeat, do not drill the new style frames to add accessories. The manufacturer will void the frame warranty. These new frames are structurally engineered very closely. The holes that are already there are not drilled. They use the same process as wheel manufacturers use to punch or extrude those holes.

If you drill the chassis, you can weaken it. Think about how many times you've seen the "DO NOT DRILL" placard on the chassis of class 8 trucks. They also have hydro-formed frames.

PullRite 5th Wheel Hitches

Because of the hydro-formed frame used on the 3rd generation (2003 and later) RAM trucks, Dodge recommends a no-drill 5th wheel hitch installations on their trucks.

Hydroforming techniques typically result in a structure of a desired shape which has a desired strength with a lighter weight, for a given volume of metal. This result is achieved in part by producing a frame member with reduced wall thickness. It has been customary to attach hitch assemblies to truck frame members by drilling holes in the walls or web of existing chassis frame members, positioning a hitch assembly mounting plate next to the frame member and threading a bolt through an openingin the mounting plate aligned with the hole bored into the chassis frame member. A nut on the bolt is then drawn down tight.

Due to the reduced wall thickness of hydroformed frame members, warranties covering hydroformed products, such as vehicle frames, often do not allow drilling additional holes or welding to such frames, beyond those that are originally designedfor by the manufacturer. Additionally, there are limits to clamping pressures which may be applied to such hydroformed frame members particularly clamping forces applied across or perpendicular to the walls or web of the hydroformed frame members. Forexample, the forces exerted on the wall of a hydroformed frame member by the head of a bolt or a nut drawn toward each other when tightening a nut to bolt the hitch assembly base to the frame member may be sufficient to collapse the wall of the framemember thereby weakening the frame member. This presents problems in connecting conventional fifth wheel hitch structures to pickup trucks incorporating hydroformed frame members. What is needed is a fifth wheel hitch structure which can be securelyattached to hydroformed frame members without the use of welds, additionally drilled holes, or excessive clamping pressures.

 

[mcramer15]

So if your not supposed to have excessive clamping force how is anything supposed to be mounted? With a clamp on then the added pressure of pulling a trailer it would seem to be excessive...

 

[Ram3500Dually]

All I can tell you is if you go to buy a hitch the kit for Dodge is a no drill, no weld kit, been that way since the 2003's first came out.

 

[mcramer15]

I dont doubt you one bit. But the reason I posted this is to see if people thought it was a good design besides the mounting. To me it seems twice as strong as anything on the market.

 

[MPD106]

I dont doubt you one bit. But the reason I posted this is to see if people thought it was a good design besides the mounting. To me it seems twice as strong as anything on the market.

looks stong to me, I have a b&w turn overball, which is suppost to be the best on the market, that looks just as good. I have heard not to drill/weld on the frame, I have allways wondered how the long bed mega cab conversion holds up so well after cutting and welding the frame.

 

[Ram3500Dually]

They not only cut and weld they plate and bolt and they do that by the above rules on where you can and cannot drill...

 

[mcramer15]

It wouldnt be hard to redesign to do a clamping type mount.

 

[da_peas_2097]

the b&w i have uses holesin the frame and has a dowel that goes into the hole to keep it from shifting front to back. but i like the design. check into how the b&w hooks up and see if you can do something like that if you dont want to drill or weld. im like you i would rather build something then buy it. i take pride in making things so i say go for it. take some pics id like to see the finished product. also if your going to build one make sure you weld a steel ring in bottom of hole where ball goes in so that supports all the weight not the pin. just a thought

 

[mcramer15]

also if your going to build one make sure you weld a steel ring in bottom of hole where ball goes in so that supports all the weight not the pin. just a thought

Thats good advice! Thanks. I didnt think about that..

 

[bwoodkid]

I work for a construction company that has about 30 gooseneck trailers. We use B&W hitches only. I have installed several models in dodges, fords and chevys. The B&W turnover is well built and heavy duty and worth the $$, but if I were to build one I would follow their design pretty close. just my .02

 

[macko300exc]

I agree with da peas 2097, i try to make as much of my own as possibly. Not just to save money; i enjoy it and it gives me something to do. But before i build some stuff; i look at what the price is of the hitch and what it will cost me to build it. For the hitch, if it were me i would buy the B&W.