Long and convoluted story, but I feel like we are taking a screwing and I'm so mad and upset right now, I could scream! My husband will be reading and answering in this thread, but since this was such a long post, I was voted the designated typist.
I will try to make this as short as possible, but is still going to be VERY long.
Purchased new 2013 Dodge cab & chassis August of last year.
Dealer #1 - 6/9/14 - Check engine light came on at 18,000 miles; dash light said "service electronic throttle control" and sometimes there was a bad delay when you pressed the gas pedal. If you would give it gas, sometimes it would just rev up, but not go anywhere....sort of like it was in neutral. It was especially bad if you did a rolling stop or if you were say pulling out into traffic and slowed down. When you would hit the gas again, there was a 5 or 6 second delay before the transmission would actually engage.
Dealer said they were unable to duplicate and rebooted the computer. We requested they replace the fuel filter at that time.
Dealer #2 - One Week Later - Week of 6/14/14 - Truck still having issues, and husband was not too impressed with the diesel mechanic at our local dealership, so he took it to a larger dealership one town over. They said there were no codes; could not duplicate; again rebooted computer said everything was good. He picked the truck up and it did it again as he was leaving the lot. Immediately went and got a service guy to ride with him and it did it while still in the parking lot. Took truck back in and he put a transmission guy on it. Transmission guy went on a ride and said it was normal and it was okay.
Dealer #1 - 7/9/2014 - Check engine light came on again. Service dept. said it was throwing a coolant level low code. Truck has less than 20K on it at this point. Coolant was NOT low. They told him there was a water sensor that was out, but they couldn't find it in the book in order for them to be able to order a new one. They didn't know which part number it was, told him they would look into it; rebooted computer; lights went off; we never heard from them again; TRUCK STILL DOING ENGINE REV/TRANNY SLIP THING. This has never been fixed. He's just learned to live with it, knowing that the complaint was on record and hoping that it would do it bad enough that they would stop telling him there was nothing wrong. I've personally been in the truck when it does this and it's pretty damn scary when you start to pull out in the road and the engine revs but the truck doesn't move. Yes, he should have been up their about it, and had it sitting on their doorstep every week, but two dealers have told him there is not really anything wrong with it.
Dealer #1 - 10/23/2014 - 27,XXX miles The DEF gauge started going to empty and back to full and back to empty. Back and forth. The transmission indicator lights (Drive, park, reverse, neutral, etc) would all turn red. All of them at once. You could not tell what gear you were in without counting. "Service Electronic Throttle" light again lit up. The check engine light would intermittently go off and on. Still doing the engine rev/not go thing. Also had a chatter when taking off. Note: At no point during any of this does the engine choke down like it's not getting fuel. It would occasionally miss when it was started, but only when cold.
When took into Dealer #1, he was informed that they only had one diesel mechanic and it would be at least a week...maybe longer....before they could even look at it. Said we could maybe take it to Dealer #2 if we needed it quicker, so he called to set up appointment.
Dealer #2 - 10/28/2014 Keep in mind this dealer is a 45 mile drive from our location. By this point it had also learned a new trick. When the truck was off....with NO key; doors shut.....the radio and dash lights would come on and go off. Besides that and the DEF gauge and the indicator lights going crazy, truck drove fine all the way to the dealership.
We heard from them the next day and they reported that the truck was missing really bad. HUH? We left a sometimes missing when started but otherwise running truck, so this was a new one on us. So much so, that I privately questioned if they were calling about the correct truck. But, the service man said "Good news. We've checked the fuel from your tank and it's good." He did say he needed us to authorize a $250 charge to diagnose further and dig into the fuel filters and injector tubes, but if it turned out to be mfg. defect causing it, we would not be charged as it would be warranty. We authorized to go further.
Next day (or two?) we get another call and said the fuel was NOT good, the injector tubes were stopped up with trash that appeared to be rust and the repair would be (are you ready?) $9,500.00.
Yes, you read that correctly. Nine-Thousand-Five-Hundred dollars.
They are claiming bad fuel. They said the lines running from the second filter (more on this in a minute) was clogged with gunk and the first filter was rusted. Now, let's discuss this point.
First, we buy 95% of our fuel from the same place. It's a new station that is probably about a year old. New tanks, etc. Not an old, ramshackle place with old fuel. We have two big trucks and several pieces of heavy equipment (dozers, etc) that run the same exact fuel. Yes, we run highway fuel through the equipment because it's a real PITA to go buy the non-hwy at the one place way across our town that sells it. Doesn't really save that much money. We run literally $1,000's of a month in diesel. Not one piece of equipment is having any issues other than the Dodge truck
Second, husband decided to drive over the dealership yesterday to see the filter for himself. He said they had 3 fuel samples taken from different places. The first two were absolutely pristine. No separation, indicating no water and there was no foreign material. The third jar he said had a few little specs of something in it. This was the sample that was dumped out from one of the fuel filters. Would it not stand to reason that a filter is going to...oh I don't know....FILTER stuff? Crazy me for thinking the filter might actually filter.
Third fuel/fuel filter point: It was not until this visit that my husband discovered that the newer cummins engines have not one, but two fuel filters. This was a new one on him as he assumed it was like all the other diesel engines he has/had and only had a single filter.
So, they take at a look at the receipt from way back on 6/9/14 from Dealer #1 and discover that they only changed ONE filter. The filter that Dealer #2 found "foreign material" was not ever changed. I feel that as a consumer, when we say change the fuel filter, they needed to either assume we meant both filters or clarify. They did neither. We assumed anything labelled a fuel filter had been changed and had no reason to question.
So, at this point they say they would have to drop the tank and see if they find anything in the fuel and if they do, warranty will not cover any of the repairs. Which in case you forgot are almost $10k. On a truck with less than 30K miles.
Now, if the truck had been running fine and all of the sudden wouldn't run, I would have really no reason to question the bad fuel diagnosis. But that's not what happened. This truck has had issues since almost the very beginning. We took it in for electronic issue, but other than the slipping thing it was pretty much running fine. Now they say that there is bad fuel, truck won't run, injectors are bad/dirty and it will cost almost as much as a new engine to fix it.
I'm just having a HUGE WTF moment here and nothing is making ANY sense. For one thing, if the fuel is coming from the tank, to the "not-replaced-like-it-was-supposed-to and had a little stuff in it" Filter #1, which then goes into LOOKED REALLY CLEAN Filter #2, which then passes to the injectors which are supposedly full of gunk....how the hell does that happen? How can the second filter be clean? Makes no sense!!
They were wanting to drop the tank to look, but I know as well as I know my name they will find SOMETHING in the tank. I would bet my right arm. I bet if you dropped ANY tank you would find some small particles! But that would be just enough for them to claim no warranty. They are like a dog with a bone. They are on this bad fuel thing (which I think is a crock of cra[) and they won't even address any of the other ongoing issues.
They gave us a number to Dodge warranty, which my husband called. That pretty much was just them putting him on hold while they call the service dept and then coming back and saying sorry, nothing we can do.
We were told the District (service?) Manager was called to the dealership and he said no warranty. We requested to speak to him personally and they refused.
I'm so upset right now I can't even see straight. I feel like they could have at least taken me out for dinner and drinks first.
If you read this far, you deserve a medal. Hope it made sense.
Any thoughts, advice, etc would be greatly appreciated.
Husband will be answering from here on out. Thank you for your time.
I will try to make this as short as possible, but is still going to be VERY long.
Purchased new 2013 Dodge cab & chassis August of last year.
Dealer #1 - 6/9/14 - Check engine light came on at 18,000 miles; dash light said "service electronic throttle control" and sometimes there was a bad delay when you pressed the gas pedal. If you would give it gas, sometimes it would just rev up, but not go anywhere....sort of like it was in neutral. It was especially bad if you did a rolling stop or if you were say pulling out into traffic and slowed down. When you would hit the gas again, there was a 5 or 6 second delay before the transmission would actually engage.
Dealer said they were unable to duplicate and rebooted the computer. We requested they replace the fuel filter at that time.
Dealer #2 - One Week Later - Week of 6/14/14 - Truck still having issues, and husband was not too impressed with the diesel mechanic at our local dealership, so he took it to a larger dealership one town over. They said there were no codes; could not duplicate; again rebooted computer said everything was good. He picked the truck up and it did it again as he was leaving the lot. Immediately went and got a service guy to ride with him and it did it while still in the parking lot. Took truck back in and he put a transmission guy on it. Transmission guy went on a ride and said it was normal and it was okay.
Dealer #1 - 7/9/2014 - Check engine light came on again. Service dept. said it was throwing a coolant level low code. Truck has less than 20K on it at this point. Coolant was NOT low. They told him there was a water sensor that was out, but they couldn't find it in the book in order for them to be able to order a new one. They didn't know which part number it was, told him they would look into it; rebooted computer; lights went off; we never heard from them again; TRUCK STILL DOING ENGINE REV/TRANNY SLIP THING. This has never been fixed. He's just learned to live with it, knowing that the complaint was on record and hoping that it would do it bad enough that they would stop telling him there was nothing wrong. I've personally been in the truck when it does this and it's pretty damn scary when you start to pull out in the road and the engine revs but the truck doesn't move. Yes, he should have been up their about it, and had it sitting on their doorstep every week, but two dealers have told him there is not really anything wrong with it.
Dealer #1 - 10/23/2014 - 27,XXX miles The DEF gauge started going to empty and back to full and back to empty. Back and forth. The transmission indicator lights (Drive, park, reverse, neutral, etc) would all turn red. All of them at once. You could not tell what gear you were in without counting. "Service Electronic Throttle" light again lit up. The check engine light would intermittently go off and on. Still doing the engine rev/not go thing. Also had a chatter when taking off. Note: At no point during any of this does the engine choke down like it's not getting fuel. It would occasionally miss when it was started, but only when cold.
When took into Dealer #1, he was informed that they only had one diesel mechanic and it would be at least a week...maybe longer....before they could even look at it. Said we could maybe take it to Dealer #2 if we needed it quicker, so he called to set up appointment.
Dealer #2 - 10/28/2014 Keep in mind this dealer is a 45 mile drive from our location. By this point it had also learned a new trick. When the truck was off....with NO key; doors shut.....the radio and dash lights would come on and go off. Besides that and the DEF gauge and the indicator lights going crazy, truck drove fine all the way to the dealership.
We heard from them the next day and they reported that the truck was missing really bad. HUH? We left a sometimes missing when started but otherwise running truck, so this was a new one on us. So much so, that I privately questioned if they were calling about the correct truck. But, the service man said "Good news. We've checked the fuel from your tank and it's good." He did say he needed us to authorize a $250 charge to diagnose further and dig into the fuel filters and injector tubes, but if it turned out to be mfg. defect causing it, we would not be charged as it would be warranty. We authorized to go further.
Next day (or two?) we get another call and said the fuel was NOT good, the injector tubes were stopped up with trash that appeared to be rust and the repair would be (are you ready?) $9,500.00.
Yes, you read that correctly. Nine-Thousand-Five-Hundred dollars.
They are claiming bad fuel. They said the lines running from the second filter (more on this in a minute) was clogged with gunk and the first filter was rusted. Now, let's discuss this point.
First, we buy 95% of our fuel from the same place. It's a new station that is probably about a year old. New tanks, etc. Not an old, ramshackle place with old fuel. We have two big trucks and several pieces of heavy equipment (dozers, etc) that run the same exact fuel. Yes, we run highway fuel through the equipment because it's a real PITA to go buy the non-hwy at the one place way across our town that sells it. Doesn't really save that much money. We run literally $1,000's of a month in diesel. Not one piece of equipment is having any issues other than the Dodge truck
Second, husband decided to drive over the dealership yesterday to see the filter for himself. He said they had 3 fuel samples taken from different places. The first two were absolutely pristine. No separation, indicating no water and there was no foreign material. The third jar he said had a few little specs of something in it. This was the sample that was dumped out from one of the fuel filters. Would it not stand to reason that a filter is going to...oh I don't know....FILTER stuff? Crazy me for thinking the filter might actually filter.
Third fuel/fuel filter point: It was not until this visit that my husband discovered that the newer cummins engines have not one, but two fuel filters. This was a new one on him as he assumed it was like all the other diesel engines he has/had and only had a single filter.
So, they take at a look at the receipt from way back on 6/9/14 from Dealer #1 and discover that they only changed ONE filter. The filter that Dealer #2 found "foreign material" was not ever changed. I feel that as a consumer, when we say change the fuel filter, they needed to either assume we meant both filters or clarify. They did neither. We assumed anything labelled a fuel filter had been changed and had no reason to question.
So, at this point they say they would have to drop the tank and see if they find anything in the fuel and if they do, warranty will not cover any of the repairs. Which in case you forgot are almost $10k. On a truck with less than 30K miles.
Now, if the truck had been running fine and all of the sudden wouldn't run, I would have really no reason to question the bad fuel diagnosis. But that's not what happened. This truck has had issues since almost the very beginning. We took it in for electronic issue, but other than the slipping thing it was pretty much running fine. Now they say that there is bad fuel, truck won't run, injectors are bad/dirty and it will cost almost as much as a new engine to fix it.
I'm just having a HUGE WTF moment here and nothing is making ANY sense. For one thing, if the fuel is coming from the tank, to the "not-replaced-like-it-was-supposed-to and had a little stuff in it" Filter #1, which then goes into LOOKED REALLY CLEAN Filter #2, which then passes to the injectors which are supposedly full of gunk....how the hell does that happen? How can the second filter be clean? Makes no sense!!
They were wanting to drop the tank to look, but I know as well as I know my name they will find SOMETHING in the tank. I would bet my right arm. I bet if you dropped ANY tank you would find some small particles! But that would be just enough for them to claim no warranty. They are like a dog with a bone. They are on this bad fuel thing (which I think is a crock of cra[) and they won't even address any of the other ongoing issues.
They gave us a number to Dodge warranty, which my husband called. That pretty much was just them putting him on hold while they call the service dept and then coming back and saying sorry, nothing we can do.
We were told the District (service?) Manager was called to the dealership and he said no warranty. We requested to speak to him personally and they refused.
I'm so upset right now I can't even see straight. I feel like they could have at least taken me out for dinner and drinks first.
If you read this far, you deserve a medal. Hope it made sense.
Any thoughts, advice, etc would be greatly appreciated.
Husband will be answering from here on out. Thank you for your time.
hehe:
