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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Im wanting to put a different turbo on but dont know which one to go with. I got 5 inch turbo back exhaust, H&S Black maxx, fully deleted. still have stock tranny for now and eventually be going with bigger injectors. Any ideas on which turbo to look at?
 

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Why a VGT? A fixed vane turbo only has one job and stays reliable.
A VGT has to many moving parts for my taste to be reliable especially in the colder climates.
 

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I'm in the same boat as op. Exhaust break is a must for me
 

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Really thinking hard about a fleece cheetah be nice if they did a group buy for us
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ya I would like to keep my exhaust brake also.
 

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I've got no complaint's with my fleece turbo, with almost 8k sense the simple swap. That's not many miles I know. But when I tow my camper the turbo pushing 28-32 lbs for 200 miles of the trip.
 

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Learn from my mistake and don't waste your money on a modded VGT. I have been very disappointed with it. Just ordered a S464 from Phil at Anarchy, they are good to deal with. I would either leave the turbo stock or go a S464 for towing and add an exhaust brake.
 

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Learn from my mistake and don't waste your money on a modded VGT. I have been very disappointed with it. Just ordered a S464 from Phil at Anarchy, they are good to deal with. I would either leave the turbo stock or go a S464 for towing and add an exhaust brake.
Can we get a detailed review of your turbo experience? What are the specs of the modded 64mm turbo you have?

I am curious for my own reasons.
 

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There's always the HE451. There's a few guys running around with those.
On this topic. I have looked into a moded VGT and I have looked into the HE451VE. The 451VE will be an expensive swap, it will be cheaper to go to a fixed vane turbo and add in an exhaust brake.

It is undeniable that the VGT have reliability issues over a good old standard fixed vane turbo. So why pay more for an unreliable turbo?

Some costs could be saved on this by not going to the full second gen swap. You can run a S4xx with an adapter, stock exhaust manifold and save more money that way.

Me personally....
I currently have a 2008 G56 with 60% exergy's and a 10 mm CP3 (Exergy) I am running Phil's second gen S467.7 with his tunes and it is VERY Streetable and tows with zero problems. I have since got a 2010 with the 68RFE and the plan is to do a swap on it as well. I am going to run the S467.7 on stock fuel with the BD Inline exhaust brake AND a pacbrake load leash. I am then getting a S471 for my 2008 and down the road might upgrade to dual CP3's and run 100% exergy's and put the 60's in the 2010.

Point of all of that is, the 2010 68RFE with a S467.7, and stock fuel will be towing the 2008 around a bit along with a 2nd gen. I have no fear in EGT's with a smart foot while towing. By going with the S467.7 on the 2010 it will grow with my plans of adding in 60's, exergy sportsman CP3, glacier diesel air intake/air flow upgrades. To go to the smaller S464 off the start for a tow rig, I would end up possibly running whot with the addition of the sportsman and the 60's. Build it right the first time, especially when right the first time will be cheaper than wrong the first.

.... I am at 1200' above sea level.

Oh and my 2008 RIPS! wicked combination, strong tunes! great turbo!
 
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Not much to tell as far as detailed experience, drivability was still good just didn't feel much of a gain. When you spend that kind of loot you want a considerable difference IMO. The turbo was made by Spectre sold through Diesel Power Products, a 64 mm, that's all I really know about it. The Fleece may perform better, not sure? I wouldn't want to take the risk. There's countless people happy with the 2nd gen swap with good power gains.
 

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I don't doubt the fix vane turbos are the old standard for power and reliability. But there's got to be a reason that manufacturers are running VGT turbos. Yeah they are an advanced technology turbo requiring more electronics and more can go wrong, but why can't you go with a bigger VGT and tune it to behave like a stocker? Won't they flow more cfm and be able to have any lag tuned out of them?

Just trying to facilitate discussion on the subject....

Mike
 

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The only reason they went to the VGT is because of the high flow EGR, they needed a turbo that would be able to create high drive pressure to force exhaust through the EGR while still creating the boost numbers that the engine needs. The VGT can move the slide to create drive pressure while producing boost at the same time. The exhaust brake is just a side effect of the VGT it wasn't designed specifically to be and exhaust brake, they kinda stumbled upon that feature. The high flow EGR is the one and only reason they designed the VGT.
 

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The only reason they went to the VGT is because of the high flow EGR, they needed a turbo that would be able to create high drive pressure to force exhaust through the EGR while still creating the boost numbers that the engine needs. The VGT can move the slide to create drive pressure while producing boost at the same time. The exhaust brake is just a side effect of the VGT it wasn't designed specifically to be and exhaust brake, they kinda stumbled upon that feature. The high flow EGR is the one and only reason they designed the VGT.

Thanks for the response! 👍
I have another question, back in the early 90's mopar started using "VNT" turbos on their turbo dodge cars. I believe it stood for Variable Nozzle Turbo. This is obviously way before emissions. Here is a quote from Wikipedia:
"The variable geometry turbo vanes were computer controlled and needed no wastegate. Instead, they adjusted the flow of exhaust gasses to spool up instantly and provide strong power. Chrysler kept the horsepower rating at 175 hp (130 kW), but upped the torque rating to 205 ft·lbs (278 Nm) at an unheard of 2100 rpm. Full torque was available from this low rpm to well past redline. Turbo lag was eliminated, with full boost (15 psi spike) available at 2100 rpm. The intense powerband, coupled with the car's low weight made the CSX-VNT very fast on the street."

So why couldn't you in theory run a big VGT turbo on a cummins and tune it to cover a wider RPM range that lights like a stocker yet carries a much bigger top end?? Just asking :)

Mike
 

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Probably scared of them cause they don't understand them, and the fixed vanes are easy. Isn't the stock turbo all in all too small for the 6.7? Or is it the exhaust manifold, or both?
 

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Probably scared of them cause they don't understand them, and the fixed vanes are easy. Isn't the stock turbo all in all too small for the 6.7? Or is it the exhaust manifold, or both?
Both, the manifold is bottle necked to help increase the drive pressure needed and the turbo is better off as a paper weight. Dont get get wrong, the stock turbo is nice for what it is and i cant complain too much but with a good turbo and manifold planting your rear to the seat the exhaust brake is quicky forgotten about.
 
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Just my dumb curiosity, but I wonder how the turbo would perform and how the drive pressures would be if you could put a high flowing manifold on with a t-4 exhaust housing on the stock vgt? Probably way more work than it's worth. Lol
 

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Just my dumb curiosity, but I wonder how the turbo would perform and how the drive pressures would be if you could put a high flowing manifold on with a t-4 exhaust housing on the stock vgt? Probably way more work than it's worth. Lol
The stock turbo and manifold have a T4i footprint, but there are a few companies that make a much better manifold that bolts right up. Before doing the 2nd gen swap on my old truck I added a PDI manifold with the stock turbo and did notice better spool up and a small gain in hp.
 
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