[RoOk247]

Well let me start off by saying a little about myself. Diesel engines pay my bills. I'm a boat captain that uses two thousand horsepower 20 cylinder emd engines. I love the sheer power a Diesel engine is capable of and not to mention being able to run 24/7 for months straight. Right now I'm on my fourth diesel truck (06 cummins 2010 cummins 07.5 duramax and now my current 2011 cummins) I don't tow anything but I'm just hooked on all the benefits of Diesel engines (many of which the EPA negates) Well I just traded a ford raptor for what I have now. The raptor was amazing but clearly doesn't have a Diesel engine. But with the raptor there's still the whole gamut of upgrades that won't get the EPA snooping. My question is what are your opinions of the future of modifying Diesel engines. With the EPA killing the dpf deletes doesn't that basically kill off every other tuning option? Turbos, intakes, and fuel additions are futile if you can't get the exhaust out right? I'm just curious what's y'all's thoughts are. I'm hoping tuners are able to get around this but who knows.

 

[ohio cummins]

New president might help the future.

 

[nick reuter]

I wish I had a crystal ball....The EPA will NOT go backwards on their emission standards, so I assume things will only get worse. Underground manufacturing of delete products may be the only way, I would never trust those products on a new truck though. The Diesel engine will get choked to death. IMO

 

[Tummat]

There are emissions friendly mods you can do.
Diesel World did a street legal 6.7 Cummins upgrade in their Jan 2013 issue

 

[RoOk247]

There are emissions friendly mods you can do.
Diesel World did a street legal 6.7 Cummins upgrade in their Jan 2013 issue

Really? Ill have to check that out. That's atleast a little bit of encouragement.

 

[ArmRippinToys]

I think that stuff will be harder to get but not impossible.

I also think it will just take time to evolve. People seem to be forgetting that cars went through this same thing in the 80's and early 90's... When "muscle cars" didn't have to much muscle. And now they have found ways to be clean, powerful, and get good gas mileage. I feel that we're going to go through a rough time but after about 5-10 years diesels will have all this emissions equipment but get good fuel economy and are after market mods will work with the equipment.


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[Bigpuddie]

Well let me start off by saying a little about myself. Diesel engines pay my bills. I'm a boat captain that uses two thousand horsepower 20 cylinder emd engines. I love the sheer power a Diesel engine is capable of and not to mention being able to run 24/7 for months straight. Right now I'm on my fourth diesel truck (06 cummins 2010 cummins 07.5 duramax and now my current 2011 cummins) I don't tow anything but I'm just hooked on all the benefits of Diesel engines (many of which the EPA negates) Well I just traded a ford raptor for what I have now. The raptor was amazing but clearly doesn't have a Diesel engine. But with the raptor there's still the whole gamut of upgrades that won't get the EPA snooping. My question is what are your opinions of the future of modifying Diesel engines. With the EPA killing the dpf deletes doesn't that basically kill off every other tuning option? Turbos, intakes, and fuel additions are futile if you can't get the exhaust out right? I'm just curious what's y'all's thoughts are. I'm hoping tuners are able to get around this but who knows.

Where do you work? I am a capt. with Edison Chouest Offshore. We run Cat 3608 Inline 8 cylinders with 4200 hp each (x 4). Wide open...1,000 rpm's

 

[bubbajubba]

Pretty sure there are companies working with the EPA on making better flowing better working dpfs and egrs. This sucks but its just some hoops we will have to jump through. Same thing the gas world has been going through for way longer than us.

 

[ram09]

Banks is 1 of those companies working with the EPA to get clean (and legal) diesel power, look them up and do some research, he seems to be WAY ahead of the curve.

 

[Jdmuscle]

The thing that gets me going is there are products in the gas world that are for off road use only and it's available to the general public. No one needs to send a letter to EPA justifying that they will only use it off road etc.... Why is it that us diesel fanatics are treated differently? Why do we need to get some a$$holes permission to modify our own trucks?

Like someone else stated... Hopefully the next president chops EPA's balls!!!

 

[jbalz]

What ever happened to land of the Free. We have more rules and regulations then freedoms and the Government is slowing taking those away as well! The way I see it is i have 2 Choices if American Government keeps this up Canada or Mexico. We defiantly need some new guys in office.

 

[jeff-kc9ftp]

Banks is 1 of those companies working with the EPA to get clean (and legal) diesel power, look them up and do some research, he seems to be WAY ahead of the curve.

Banks USED to be the one to go to, back in the 90's or early 2000's. But the $$ per HP got way out of hand. Now, if you take a look at the website, about the only thing they will sell you for a new diesel is a cold air intake or an overpriced tailpipe.

One other possible reason for diesels not being able to slip by with the "off-road use only" disclaimer is that off-road equipment will have to meet the emissions requirements for particulates and Nox (Tier-4). It gets phased in by 2015, some off-road engines are already required to meet it. Tier-4 "off-road" is roughly = to 2008-2010 on-road emissions. So, DPF, EGR and probably DEF.

Oh, and my "guess" as to why gas gets by with "off-road use only"....they aren't actively advertising removal of the cat converter(s). Most of the exhaust mods, are advertised to work with the converter in place and the canned tunes don't do anything to allow for removing the converter(s).

Jeff.

 

[JEDJR]

Good information here, this subject needs to be made a "Sticky" on the top of the page as there will be no end to this discussion.

 

[Dieselfan2011]

I think that stuff will be harder to get but not impossible.

I also think it will just take time to evolve. People seem to be forgetting that cars went through this same thing in the 80's and early 90's... When "muscle cars" didn't have to much muscle. And now they have found ways to be clean, powerful, and get good gas mileage. I feel that we're going to go through a rough time but after about 5-10 years diesels will have all this emissions equipment but get good fuel economy and are after market mods will work with the equipment.


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So in the mean time we have to suffer and just deal with the garbage we are dealt with for the next 5-10 years?
They should give us the option to do as we wish. At least till the auto makers have a chance to get the bugs worked out of the junk they are putting on our vehicles. It should be a reliable system before its sold to the consumer. We shouldn't have to worry about a warranty on a new truck. And it seems like a lot of the warranty issues are emissions related.


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[RoOk247]

Where do you work? I am a capt. with Edison Chouest Offshore. We run Cat 3608 Inline 8 cylinders with 4200 hp each (x 4). Wide open...1,000 rpm's

I work on the Mississippi and other rivers shoving tows around. I regret never making the jump to near coastal or blue water.

 

[RoOk247]

The thing that gets me going is there are products in the gas world that are for off road use only and it's available to the general public. No one needs to send a letter to EPA justifying that they will only use it off road etc.... Why is it that us diesel fanatics are treated differently? Why do we need to get some a$$holes permission to modify our own trucks?

Like someone else stated... Hopefully the next president chops EPA's balls!!!

I think alot of the reason diesel is getting pursued so hard where as gas isn't is because diesel is used so much for an actual industry. Anything that is shipped in bulk is shipped with a Diesel engine. Wether it's by train boat or 18 wheeler. I wonder what group is really pushing for all this crap. Ruin the mileage on every means of shipment and certain companies look to make a hell of a lot more money then they do all ready. Leave it up the our government to ruin the most effective fuel for means of transportation. Diesel has been huge overseas for the longest and it finally starts to make a come up in the US and the EPA strangles the engines.

 

[Tummat]

Really? Ill have to check that out. That's atleast a little bit of encouragement.

I was interested in this being stationed in Europe.


It’s as if the US government doesn’t want private diesel owners. I mean any time they add taxes and/or restrictions it’s to squeeze it out of existence. Diesel cars are all over place here in Europe making 20 – 30 mpg but not in the US. Hum but the current government wants to be more like Europe oh wait they take only what they need to help solidify their agenda.

 

[pronstar]

Emissions regs didn't kill the aftermarket gas-engine performance industry, so diesel-engine performance should also survive.

It will evolve, and probably become more expensive as gains will be harder to come by. But if there's money to be made, then someone smart will figure it out.


2 Tapatalk 1 Cup

 

[patrickSDP]

I'm just curious what's y'all's thoughts are. I'm hoping tuners are able to get around this but who knows.

Great question and discussion. I consider myself a diesel enthusiast first, and someone who works in the industry second. As an enthusiast, I think the old days are gone. Plain and simple. We've seen that change in the tuning world. And it has/will affect other hard parts like turbo kits, injectors, twin CP3's, etc. Not that they won't be available, but where they can be shipped. California, for instance, we do not ship turbo kits, twin CP3's, lock-up boxes, intake or exhaust manifolds. Simply because they do not have CARB numbers.

In a sense, the question will be how many states follow California and restrict what parts are available. I'm not sure that's a question that can be answered. Only time will tell.

The challenge is that diesel emission technology lags HORRIBLY behind the unleaded market. The unleaded industry has the highest powered most fuel efficient vehicles in its history. The same cannot be said for diesel trucks. Yes, they are clean, but also average considerably less economy than their predecessors. So until emission technology advances, the market will stay like this.

I don't think any of us would mind a truck that didn't smoke, could make 500-600hp and get 20-25mpg - and roll into the most strict emission testing facility in the US and pass. But that's not a reality at this time. So I think the aftermarket AND OEM need to put their heads together and work on a solution. Short cuts around it just won't fly anymore.

 

[ArmRippinToys]

Great question and discussion. I consider myself a diesel enthusiast first, and someone who works in the industry second. As an enthusiast, I think the old days are gone. Plain and simple. We've seen that change in the tuning world. And it has/will affect other hard parts like turbo kits, injectors, twin CP3's, etc. Not that they won't be available, but where they can be shipped. California, for instance, we do not ship turbo kits, twin CP3's, lock-up boxes, intake or exhaust manifolds. Simply because they do not have CARB numbers.

In a sense, the question will be how many states follow California and restrict what parts are available. I'm not sure that's a question that can be answered. Only time will tell.

The challenge is that diesel emission technology lags HORRIBLY behind the unleaded market. The unleaded industry has the highest powered most fuel efficient vehicles in its history. The same cannot be said for diesel trucks. Yes, they are clean, but also average considerably less economy than their predecessors. So until emission technology advances, the market will stay like this.

I don't think any of us would mind a truck that didn't smoke, could make 500-600hp and get 20-25mpg - and roll into the most strict emission testing facility in the US and pass. But that's not a reality at this time. So I think the aftermarket AND OEM need to put their heads together and work on a solution. Short cuts around it just won't fly anymore.

Essentially that's what I was trying to say. Technology will catch up it'll jut take 5-10 years. Hopefully soon but pnly time will tell


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