Regeneration is calculated by measureing the exhaust pressure at the inlet and outlet of the DPF. As the soot builds up, the inlet pressure increases and the outlet decreases. At some predetermined point, it goes into regeneration. No timer. Only way around this process is to delete, using sims or a tuner.
Then someone needs to either edit or delete the sticky in the tech section (EGT sim basics) it says that to run code free dpf delete to use 330 ohm sims, but if you don't have a way to clear the regen timer you will eventually get an attempted regen then a limp mode.
Yeah, I need to know about that! For absolutely sure! I used the 330 ohm sims but sure don't need to go into limp mode over 1000 miles from home! Just did the delete this past Sunday.
Do I need to replace with the 100 ohm sims?
Hadn't seen that particular write-up before, only about the codes and the 330 sims which is why I got the 330 sims instead of the 100's.
Now there seems to be conflicting info whether or not there's a timer that will eventually cause limp mode, according to XDP there is altho
it may not happen for many thousands of miles, or it may happen in just a few thousand. I can't take that chance.
So now I'll have to go to the local Radio Shack and get some 100 ohm resistors and replace those 330 ohm resistors in the sims.
(Found out that RSD doesn't sell those DPF sims any more, but XDP does. However, XDP doesn't carry the pressure sim, and I can't
tell for sure if I'm going to need it or not.)
That's one thing that's caused me a number of mis-steps - I'll see a sticky that usually was written some time ago that says certain things,
and is referred to as everything I need to know. Don't want to end up in limp mode 1/2 way up a mountain 1,000 miles from home!
Then someplace else, I'll find another, usually later, writeup that gives more info and changes things.
Case in point, this 330 ohm vs 100 ohm DPF resistor thing. I've got the 330 sims, now have to take those out and replace the resistors
so I don't go into limp mode half way across the country. And just luck I stumbled on this post that asked a question about it and contained
a link to the updated info, or I never would have known and had the risk of going into limp mode halfway up a mountain out west. I'm going
to drive about 6k or 7k miles before I get home in about 6 weeks.
Makes me nervous about what else I haven't stumbled across, like with the EGR unplug & block, and the DFP pressure sim thing that I've
seen a little info on but not sure where it ends up.
It would be helpful if all posts on this forum dealing with each of these more technical issues were all gathered together in one specific topic folder i.e.
in the tech section. One folder for EGR, one for deleting, one for transmissions, etc etc.
The 300ohm sims let a DPF timer run, so as you found out you got the regen message as it tried to regen.
but no cel using 300ohms
the 100hm sims tells the system it's to hot.
do not regen. and the timer doesn't matter because it's to hot to regen and will not try.
but it will light up the cel with over temp codes for the heat probes.
I covered the cel with some windo-film (used a half circle)
Some are concerned that if they had a additional problem that they wouldn't know.
If it was an important problem the truck will let you know in other ways.
the cell is really a lot of soft codes and occasionally reading the codes with a reader can settle any nerves.
I found out about the 300 ohm sims and the regen timer in the link earlier in this thread.
Have only driven it about 15 miles since I did the delete and installed the 300's.
So no regen / limp.
Needless to say, I'm getting some 100 resistors at Radio Shack and swapping in for the 300's in the sims I have, lots cheaper than buying new ready made 100 sims. And I need them today.
But I did have a CEL with the 300's - some more stuff I've found says that the CEL will also activate without a sim in the pressure transducer, or whatever it is. So that's maybe why my CEL. But the CEL is so small, it's no biggy. MUCH rather not have the fear of a regen attempt and limp mode out in the middle of nowhere!
I do have an Edge CTS so can check for other codes on occasion or if something is suspicious.
I guess with the non-harmful codes, if they're cleared that might cause problems? Like if it's cleared on startup, at least with the 100 sims? I read that somewhere not long ago in this forum - someplace.
Come to think of it, the truck is in the shop right now (after the delete) to figure out a red brake warning light which I suppose they'll clear when they get it fixed. Hope that doesn't cause a problem when they clear the codes - I'm assuming there are some in there because of the delete. Oh, the twists & turns!
I don't know but don't think the CTS allows clearing of individual codes, I think it's all or nothing.
I wouldn't be quite so concerned, but am supposed to leave on a 17k mile trip Wed or Thurs this week to finish up my last job out near Vegas, pulling a mostly empty 20' Cargo trailer. I guess I'll find out.
I suppose one either gets over temp codes, or the regen timer gets you. Too bad there's not a happy medium i.e. with 200 or 150 ohm sims that would still keep the timer from causing trouble but not give the over temp codes. I haven't seen anything like that discussed.
Ran the 300 ohm sims and a pressure sim for two years with only a CEL on (yes it still illuminated). Not sure about the DPF timer thing as mine only went into regen after first installing the SIMS and never again after that. I could dig up my old pressure SIM and give you the values for the resistors if you want. Personally, EFI Live is the fix to all these problems, although a bit more expensive too.
Seems I've read that clearing the codes on startup causes some kind of problem? Or does the 10 second delay prevent that?
If it matters, I'll be using 100 sims as soon as I can replace the 300 resistors in the sims I installed when I did the delete just this past Sunday.
Absolutely have to avoid regen attempt and limp problems that I've read will eventually happen with the 300's. I can easily live with the CEL and the non-harmful temp codes from the 100 resistors.
There's been discussion about any write command given to the ECM while the truck is off. If there's a low voltage you could cause residual memory imprinting in the ECM. Also, solid state memory can only been written to "?" times. So that's why I ran with a CEL is to minimize the chance of low voltage write commands and ultimately avoid any problems - which is especially a concern in winter months after using the grid heater and the batteries being low on voltage due to extreme low temps (-40 not uncommon here). It always goes through my mind now when I clear codes but you gotta do what you gotta do and I usually am doing it after it's been running a while anyways so batteries are at their peak.
There is a counter not a timer for say. If the truck goes to long and does not see a active regen then the computer will put truck limp mode and cel will come on. If you can reset it. Helps keep the problems away on deleting with sims.
Keep us advised of your progress Macx, I read a article on this forum the other day that said there is a timer so if there is no regen initiated after 24000 seconds the computer will initiate one. Lot of different answers on some of this stuff so update if you can now and then.
I truly wish I had better news, but seem to be regressing.
To recap, I deleted using 300 sims and no pressure sim. Didn't know about the pressure sim until after I started the engine briefly twice to see if it surged, which it didn't. Got a CEL as I expected. Didn't have the CTS hooked up yet so couldn't read codes. No "service required, see dealer now" messages either.
Had to get it into town yesterday afternoon for something else and leave it until this afternoon.
As soon as I started it yesterday, and again today to bring it home, I got chimes and a "Service Required - See Dealer Now" message that quite frankly spooks me. Don't know what to expect. Altho I didn't get on it hard at all because of the cold weather it didn't seem to run any different and responded well to light throttle. Stayed the same into and back from town.
I'm going to get some 100 resistors tomorrow and replace the 300's before I run it again.
Also going to finish hooking up the SCT tomorrow.
Should I clear codes before I start it again? Sounds like doing that in cold temps isn't such a hot idea, pardon the pun.
After I had that message, I did some more digging and saw that I maybe should have had a pressure sim when using the 300's, but that I shouldn't need it with the 100's.
After the low voltage info, above, it sounds like after I swap the resistors I should start it and warm the engine & batteries before I clear any codes? At least I've got my block heater cord hooked up so that'll help. I could also run a battery charger on it while code clearing, before or after starting & running.
Does the message indicate I'm headed for trouble of some sort, i.e. a regen attempt and then a derate, even with swapping to 100 sims and clearing the codes?
From what I've found so far, it sounds like the 100 sims will never generate a regen attempt and derate, and that's without a pressure sim. They'll supposedly just do the CEL and create some harmless temp related codes whenever run.
If that's legit, will I have problems relating to the existing service/dealer message or will swapping to the 100 resistors and clearing codes clear that and not give me a regen attempt? If not, what do I have to do to clear the message, and prevent a regen attempt and derate.
The big problem is that I've got a very limited amount of time to fool around with this. Yes, I'd love to do the EFI live but have already bankrupt my social security for the next couple months on this truck and it would really be a godsend if I could get it working just with sims somehow.
I'll have the DTS hooked up before noon, but won't have the resistors in hand to do the 300 to 100 swap until tomorrow evening, so won't have the sims back in until Thurs AM.
Appreciate any more info and good advice from experience, please no opinions passed off as fact, or incomplete info. Have had enuf of that already.
Yes, sure is a lot of apparently conflicting or incomplete info circulating.
Well, good old Bing found me some more info, and of course some conflicts between posts, both on here and on another Cummins forum.
Some guys say might be the CCV filter, some guys say that's a slightly different message and without the See Dealer Now part of it. I've got a new filter so won't take long to give that a whirl.
Most guys (altho with tuners) say to reset the codes twice.
Couple guys said the key on, brake-brake-gas-gas key off trick should do it, might have to do it twice. A Chrysler service tech said it's gas 3 times.
A bunch of guys say they get that thing every once in awhile and don't report any regen attempts or derates on account of it. Gosh I do hope that holds with mine!
So, will try the CCV filter just in case being I have a new one (come to think of it I disconnected that vent tube from the turbo - ?? altho nobody's reported a problem from doing that).
Another guy had a supposedly Chrysler scenario about disconnecting all the battery cables then touching a specific couple of them together. That's scary! Very last resort, only, maybe!
After I get the 100 resistors swapped in, I'll start it and try clearing codes, twice if that msg doesn't go away. They said to clear twice even if no codes are shown.
At least it doesn't seem that message indicates there's regen attempt and derate problems about to happen. That's the big worry.
So 100 sims then a start and code clearing to see what that does, and the brake gas thing if I still have the message. Will post results about Thurs by noon.
EDIT: just read XDP's description of the 100 ohm sims and it DOES say the pressure sim "may be required." Well, it isn't much, so it's worth a try. But I'll have to have them send it to my RV near Vegas where I'm working, I'm leaving home here probly friday.
Macx, Snofarmer the other day had a post on similar thread and said he has sims and ran a hose from one port to another on the pressure thing. Does that make sense? I have no idea but really am interested in you being successful at this and doing it at reasonable cost. Btw, my social security hardly covers diesel and propane lately.
NE MN? Spent my 1st 40 living in or at least based out of central MN and my grandparents lived in Duluth in their later years. Mom grew up in Aitkin.
I've read various opinions on leaving those ports open or connecting them. Without some type of gadget or process to influence the pressure in there between them, I don't know what difference that would make. Some folks say a person might just want to keep the dirt out of them.
As I understand it, that device looks for a pressure difference between the before-DPF and the after-DPF to alert the computer when the DPF is getting plugged to the point it's causing a certain amount of restriction so the computer knows to do a regen.
I would imagine the sims maybe simulate some amount of that pressure difference. Too much and it would cause a regen, but the correct amount within the range the computer expects and sees as normal operating conditions I would think would help prevent some codes and maybe even the CEL if that was the only thing causing it.
So I guess thinking thru it like that, plus what the XDP/Shibby information says, probly a good thing to try. I guess people can make their own, but that it's a difficult thing to get right. And $40 is about the least expensive thing I've bought for my truck, except for the ~$0.75 Dorman plug to help with the EGR decommissioning.
I think I'll give that sim a try, but will have to wait till I can get it delivered to my RV out near Vegas where i've got to finish out about a month's work at my last job.
In the meantime will try the code clearing and the message clearing thing.
Keep warm up there! Brutal winter from all accounts, pretty much all over the country. I'm looking into non-typical heat sources for when I move to WY starting this summer - such as ground water heat pump (no fuel required, just a relatively minor amount of electric), and using all that WY wind to generate some electric to pre-heat water going into the water heater and maybe even run some low voltage electric supplemental heat, and as backup for when the power goes out as it often does away from town. My buddy burns wood pellets in a couple automatic pellet stoves and really likes that setup and says they heat his house lots cheaper than LP (or of course electric) which is their only other option.
Yes, retirement is "reverse sticker shock". That's a shame after as hard as a person works all his life!
Macx, Two Harbors here, grew up north of Wadena. If I were to build again It would be one story buried in a hill of dirt. Wyoming would be nice, always liked to go to Mt and Wy fishing and just for trips. Keep us posted on the deletes every now and then.
We had a neighbor that did that in some hillside property they bought from me in MN. Pretty inexpensive to heat & cool, esp on the South side of the hill out of the wind and with lots of tall leafy trees for summer shade.
In WY I don't have enuf hill to do that, besides all that concrete is too much work for this old man!
Going to sorta copy one I had a chance to look over in Montana - to save a bunch of money on garage space and roof, gonna build a 32 x 48 3+ stall garage that will also house my bikes and the utilities and some heated storage space, then build the house on top of it. No going outside or to a cold garage to tinker! And saved about 2,000 square foot of garage roofing and trusses. The downstairs garage will be warm enuf to tinker and can be warmed up a little easily, and have floor drains under a couple of the vehicles so I can let them melt off and wash them in comfort in cold weather. When the building inspector goes away, then an inside stairs will be replaced by a 4x8 hydraulic elevator, basically built like a large scissors type vehicle lift, going from alongside our grocery getter vehicle up right into the end of the kitchen. Mine and my wife's knees aren't the best and are sure not to get any better!
Anyway - Couldn't wait, went to town and got my resistors for the sim surgery. Really anxious now to see how that's gonna turn out. Probly won't start it until tomorrow unless it warms up more today than forecast so far, but might throw a charger on the batteries and try the message and code clearing this afternoon.
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