Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I emailed H&S but they had nothing for me...

Sometimes if I try to accelerate at part throttle boost will start surging past 20 and the truck wont accelerate. It kind of bucks like it's hitting defuel. When this happens there's a loud surging type of sound as boost increases. The first time it happened I was just driving on mild. I turned onto a highway on ramp and was accelerating normally and suddenly the truck wouldn't accelerate in any gear. I put it back to no power and it drove normal. A few hours later I drove again and it would drive normally on mild again.

It's been fine for a few days, but the other day it happened again on no power. I tried accelerating at about 1500rpm, I think 5th gear, and boost would surge up/weird noise/no acceleration. Then again today, on the highway driving on mild and towing about 4500. At about 1600 in 6th gear I needed to accelerate a little and it happened again. Both of these instances I could accelerate if I went lighter on the throttle, but at about 1/4 throttle plus this problem would happen.

Any ideas?

To me it seems like it's trying to boost too high at too low of RPM and too little throttle... Boosting 20-30psi at 1500 rpm at part throttle. This is happening at what I would call 1/4 throttle.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
Download the latest update and use the stock turbo tuning.

You didn't by chance pull the silencer ring out of the turbo did you? If you did put it back in its not a silencer ring its an antisurge ring and will also cause the problem you described if its out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
872 Posts
Download the latest update and use the stock turbo tuning.

You didn't by chance pull the silencer ring out of the turbo did you? If you did put it back in its not a silencer ring its an antisurge ring and will also cause the problem you described if its out.
:agree2::agree2:

Also try to return it to stock then re load the tune of your choice. I havent ran into that problem yet. Are you getting any codes?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Well I am running .16 default download with torque management on. According to H&S that is the mild tune/no turbo tuning. I guess I'll update it to .17 and see if it helps.

I haven't removed the silencer ring. There are no codes.

This isn't a consistent problem. Most of the time I can accelerate part throttle with no problem. Only occasionally the boost starts surging like this.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
Let us know how it works out for you. One other possibility is you have a leak in your egr delete. Loosing exhaust pressure on occasion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Let us know how it works out for you. One other possibility is you have a leak in your egr delete. Loosing exhaust pressure on occasion.
Will do. Don't have an EGR delete. The only things done to my truck is airaid intake, dpf delete (still have stock downpipe), and the MM.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
Did you get the flapper unplugged. It could be closing. That would cause exactly what you are describing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I finally got around to updating the MM. I updated from .16 mild/no turbo tune to .18 mild/no turbo tune... My truck now drives way smoother. Boost behaves much differently than it did with .17. Boost comes on much smoother without surging at part throttle on no power and mild. I tested it out a lot today and I'm much happier with the MM now. The only thing left to do is see if it'll tow on mild without surging.

It's interesting how significant the change was for me doing this update considering what their update notes say. Whatever they did I like it though.

Did you get the flapper unplugged. It could be closing. That would cause exactly what you are describing.
Never saw this post... I've not unplugged anything, and actually wouldn't know how to go about doing what you're saying. It seems updating the MM fixed the issue for now though!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
When you run the tune for the dpf delete on the mini maxx you are supposed to unplug the egr and the flapper. If you don't it could result in engine damage. They are both on the air intake. EGR is on top of it and the flapper is on the piece that is below and before it.

Go to this link page 17 has the instructions. If your dpf is gone this has to be done.
http://www.hsperformance.com/wp-content/themes/Quadro/images/blackmaxx.pdf

You are correct about the last update. I know it was a complete rewrite of the engine tune casey told me that much he got real vague about the whys. Torque converter lockup was involved and I was telling him about the turbo issue at the time. I was told quite a while before the update was released. But most of the stuff it says was done is total BS. I run a smarty now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Well unfortunately the towing test didn't go as great as I hoped. The surging is still there on mild with the trailer. I can't hardly breath on the throttle in 5th/6th without the surging. It seemed ok accelerating 1-4.

When you run the tune for the dpf delete on the mini maxx you are supposed to unplug the egr and the flapper. If you don't it could result in engine damage. They are both on the air intake. EGR is on top of it and the flapper is on the piece that is below and before it.

Go to this link page 17 has the instructions. If your dpf is gone this has to be done.
http://www.hsperformance.com/wp-content/themes/Quadro/images/blackmaxx.pdf
The 07-09s have to do that, the 2010+ can leave the EGR completely stock.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
101 Posts
It is my understanding, from reading the minimax installation instructions, that beginning with 2010, the software automatically turns off the egr.

I believe that nothing needs to be unplugged as with previous years....correct me if I'm wrong.:confused013:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
I think I would unplug it to be safe. The manual may not have been updated. The other models its referring to may be the chevy and ford not the newer year model dodges. It will only take you about 5 minutes. If it fixes the problem your golden if not its not going to hurt anything.

The madds site has better photos to show you where the plugs are located and you can click on them to enlarge them. Disregaurd all the nonsense they want you to do with the egr just unplug the brown plug nothing else. Pay close attention to the pictures of the throttle valve thats the tough one. It can cause some real surging issues. Make sure you get it unplugged. The plug on the cooler doesn't really matter. The underlined stuff is the link.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,160 Posts
Can you explain the reason behind doing that? I though the H&S shuts off the EGR stuff?
I was having issues a while back that I narrowed down to the valve on the EGR cooler. Even though it is stated it shouldn't be an issue, it was for me. I was just giving an option to help with your problem. It didn't effect anything in my case by unplugging it, other than fixing the issue I had, so it will be a guess to whether it will fix your problem or not.

My problem was a short buck of the engine at cruising speed with an immediate jump in EGTs and a drop of the boost. Lasted for about 5 seconds.

One thing you might want to do is set one of your main gauges on the MM to show the throttle position. Then monitor that when things goof up. The actual sensor it is monitoring is the APP (Accelerator Pedal Position). If it jumps when you are trying to maintain a constant slow speed, then the APP is at fault.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,160 Posts
I thought I would bring your thread back to see if any more help would come along. Interested in seeing if you had switched the MM to show the TPS or not?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
945 Posts
Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
I've been really busy so I haven't been looking into this in awhile.

I have monitored the throttle position. I've never had any issues at cruising or steady throttle, but it does show much higher % than what I'm actually pressing when this problem occurs. If I just barely press the throttle it jumps way up, just a rough example if I press 1/4 throttle TPS will jump to 75%. I write this off to how the tuning makes more power, inflating the throttle position signal to provide more throttle response to put it simply. I don't mean to say this as I actually know what's going on with how anything involved in these trucks tuning works, because I don't, but I've observed all this closely. This takes me back to my original conclusion, something in the tuning is allowing the manual trucks to attempt to boost too much with too little throttle and too little RPM. When I first installed .16 there was times I was seeing 30lb surges at 1/4 throttle and 1500-1700 rpm even on no power. And this is mild/no turbo tuning/torque management on.

Whatever they did between .16 and .18 helped this issue dramatically so it's hard for me to believe it's anything other than something in the tuning. Especially now with that new thread with some other guys describing what sounds like what I'm talking about.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
526 Posts
The madds site has better photos to show you where the plugs are located and you can click on them to enlarge them. Disregaurd all the nonsense they want you to do with the egr just unplug the brown plug nothing else.
I have a question on this..... I am looking at the H&S and the Smarty for a dpf delete. H&S says to just unplug stuff. Mads says, in addition to unplugging a couple things, to remove EGR actuator motor, remove the plunger, and leave the EGR motor plugged in and "zip tied" somewhere in the engine compartment.

If I use the Mads Smarty, can I just unplug the EGR motor? If I have to take it apart and "zip tie" it, I'll probably go with the H&S...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
617 Posts
I have a question on this..... I am looking at the H&S and the Smarty for a dpf delete. H&S says to just unplug stuff. Mads says, in addition to unplugging a couple things, to remove EGR actuator motor, remove the plunger, and leave the EGR motor plugged in and "zip tied" somewhere in the engine compartment.

If I use the Mads Smarty, can I just unplug the EGR motor? If I have to take it apart and "zip tie" it, I'll probably go with the H&S...
Yeah you can just unplug it. I don't know why they haven't updated that yet. It makes no difference in the power any longer and hasn't for quite some time. I'm running the smarty and can't even remember where I put my egr valve so its sure not plugged in and zip tied.

I emailed marco about it a while back just to confirm this was the case. He said it didn't matter if it was there or not any longer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
526 Posts
Yeah you can just unplug it. I don't know why they haven't updated that yet. It makes no difference in the power any longer and hasn't for quite some time. I'm running the smarty and can't even remember where I put my egr valve so its sure not plugged in and zip tied.

I emailed marco about it a while back just to confirm this was the case. He said it didn't matter if it was there or not any longer.
Thanks...... I appreciate the info :thumbsup:
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top