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brownbear 09-19-2019 09:59 PM

End of Days Near for Internal Combustion?
 
Daimler stops developing internal combustion engines to focus on electric cars

https://electrek.co/2019/09/19/daiml...electric-cars/

dillonjm 09-19-2019 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brownbear (Post 29094345)
Daimler stops developing internal combustion engines to focus on electric cars

https://electrek.co/2019/09/19/daiml...electric-cars/

A little premature to make that leap. Those are both German automakers. Germany, and to a large extent Europe in general, are far more spring loaded toward electric than the US.

Germany has other political things going on too which are driving this.

I donít think we are there yet on this side of the Atlantic.

cumminsturbofreak 09-19-2019 10:35 PM

Electrek is a website that pushes the electric car. They've been posting things like this for awhile...

With the hazards and pollution of lithium battery production, I don't really think battery powered electrics are the future. We need something like hydrogen.

Regal2800 09-19-2019 11:26 PM

Electric is not perfect but it’s definitely the next power source for cars in the foreseeable future. Accounting for battery pollution and energy production, the epa has charts out there to show that electric cars like Tesla get an equivalent 90-100 mpg.

Hydrogen is cool but it is not nearly as efficient as electric motor as there is a lot of energy loss in the process.

Infrastructure will change to accommodate ev and battery charge times will decrease making it more and more viable. I really like the ic but I agree their days are numbered when it comes to cars and trucks.

brownbear 09-20-2019 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cumminsturbofreak (Post 29094381)
Electrek is a website that pushes the electric car. They've been posting things like this for awhile...

With the hazards and pollution of lithium battery production, I don't really think battery powered electrics are the future. We need something like hydrogen.

The website is irrelevant, I was just posting it because the news is that Daimler Chrysler will no longer be developing IC engines. That's a pretty big step, in my opinion.

kylant 09-20-2019 12:21 PM

pretty cool when your electricity is produced by a coal burning power plant.
so therefore, you have a coal burning tesla :)

Jimmy N. 09-20-2019 12:53 PM

One of these days the proponents of electric cars will have to realize that not everybody lives in a city. And that even those who do leave it on occasion.

It would be a massive undertaking to create the necessary infrastructure (not that it doesn't need an upgrade as it is) before electric cars would be even remotely feasible in large parts of the country.

And then there's that little problem with where the power is coming from in the first place.

cumminsturbofreak 09-20-2019 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy N. (Post 29094789)
One of these days the proponents of electric cars will have to realize that not everybody lives in a city. And that even those who do leave it on occasion.

It would be a massive undertaking to create the necessary infrastructure (not that it doesn't need an upgrade as it is) before electric cars would be even remotely feasible in large parts of the country.

And then there's that little problem with where the power is coming from in the first place.

That's why I say Lithium battery EVs are not the future. Great for cities, bad for everyone else outside the city. We can still use electrical motors, but we need an alternate "fuel" to power them.

Russ661 09-20-2019 01:10 PM

I think the automotive industry as a whole will move toward electric vehicles that use a common battery type and the installation of that battery will be such that it allows for quick change capabilities so that rather than having to plug in for hours to recharge one would simply drive into a refit station where the entire battery could be changed out by a robot in less time than it takes to refuel today. Batteries would be cleaned, tested and recharged robotically as well, then put in stock for reuse. Batteries that test bad would be returned to a recycling/rebuilding center to be remanufactured. This whole scenario is already in use on a trial basis in China!

Jimmy N. 09-20-2019 01:11 PM

Friends of mine are coming to visit from SoCal soon. They could technically use an electric car there.

Let's say they had one. How long would it take them to traverse the 1,000 miles to the east, mostly along the relatively desolate I-40, then through far more desolate parts away, from the interstate?

In comparison, I've done that stretch in 12 hours (wasn't towing) with two fuel stops. If my friend didn't have his wife with him, he'd probably get here in 14 or so.

I don't know how long it would take with an electric car, but probably several days. And that would be with careful planning.

Jimmy N. 09-20-2019 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ661 (Post 29094811)
...so that rather than having to plug in for hours to recharge one would simply drive into a refit station where the entire battery could be changed out by a robot in less time than it takes to refuel today.

That could work...if we had more of those refit stations than we have gas stations now.
Or if the range those batteries could provide would be as good or better than what current vehicles can achieve.

EricPeterson 09-20-2019 01:28 PM

Daimler doesn't say they're no longer developing IC engines. They say they're not developing fundamentally new engine families. The life cycle of the existing designs will support incremental improvements for decades to come. As noted, there's only so much we can do with the basic mechanicals. I imagine tweaks to combustion chamber, valve, and cam design will continue furiously for just as long, to support.....

Development of ever-more-efficient intake, induction, exhaust, and ignition control systems is still going strong everywhere. That's what my employer does. There's no indication that marine, heavy truck, OTR, off-highway, or equipment engines will vanish. Development continues furiously -- always aimed at improving efficiency, specific power, and emissions control. No doubt the development of better engine management systems for smaller engines will continue as well.

Remember that the single greatest reason fuel-burning engines make poisons and other non-optimum by-products is the process regime transitions as RPMs change. Support for a range of RPMs is nothing but compromise. Once the need to run at anything other than a single, optimally efficient speed is gone, it's possible to do things with fine-tuning an engine that are totally impossible when the engine is connected to the wheels, no matter how many gears there are. What do you do with that single RPM, super-efficient engine?

You hook it up to a super-efficient generator that also wants to run at the one single speed and you make electricity.

I believe fuel-burning engines will exist as the alternate -- and long range -- recharging system components of hybrids until such time as a system for storing energy at substantially higher -- read, orders of magnitude higher -- densities is found. And that, unfortunately, is still science fiction.

JMHO


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