12v valve stem (old style) seals slipping off head - Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum
94-98 Powertrain Discussion of components that are directly involved in the power production and all that is needed to get and keep the truck moving . Engine , Transmission Ect...NO ADVERTISING

 1Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-30-2019, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
12v valve stem (old style) seals slipping off head

Hey everyone. So while doing my 60lb valve springs i decided to replace all 12 valve stem seals. I got Mahle 216-1114 seals. The entire job went straight forward. Used a correctly sized socket and a little mallet and lightly tapped the seals down onto the head. I made sure the seals were lubed up so they didn't tear. About a week later I pulled the valve covers to check on things and noticed on cylinders 1,3,4, all 6 valve stem seals lifted off the head and were riding around on the valve. I tore it all back apart one cylinder at a time and reseated the seals on the head. Next day, same deal. 6 seals lifted off the head. Any help or suggestions? Thank you!

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2229.jpg
Views:	42
Size:	100.7 KB
ID:	846863  
5912valve is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-30-2019, 07:04 PM
Diesel Head
 
GAmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Killeen, TX
Posts: 15,979
Thanks: 149
Thanked 1,719 Times in 1,505 Posts
iTrader Score: 7 reviews
You lubed the seals and expected them to stay put? I recommend you install them dry.

97 3500, 2 WD, G56, slightly bombed, 1.3 million miles. Started the second million on 8/24/13
If you are lucky enough to be in Texas, you are lucky enough.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 3 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
GAmes is online now  
post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 08:54 AM
Diesel Head
 
GAmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Killeen, TX
Posts: 15,979
Thanks: 149
Thanked 1,719 Times in 1,505 Posts
iTrader Score: 7 reviews
Since they are now stretched out a dab of thread locker on each one won't hurt.

97 3500, 2 WD, G56, slightly bombed, 1.3 million miles. Started the second million on 8/24/13
If you are lucky enough to be in Texas, you are lucky enough.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 3 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
GAmes is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-06-2019, 04:06 PM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAmes View Post
Since they are now stretched out a dab of thread locker on each one won't hurt.
I brake cleaned everything and used a little loctite on the seals, let it dry, put it all back together and the same ones that slipped off before, slipped off again. I’m at a loss
5912valve is offline  
post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-06-2019, 04:28 PM
Diesel Head
 
myother4x4isaCJ7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Dufur oregon
Posts: 3,614
Thanks: 42
Thanked 329 Times in 309 Posts
iTrader Score: 2 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5912valve View Post
I brake cleaned everything and used a little loctite on the seals, let it dry, put it all back together and the same ones that slipped off before, slipped off again. Iím at a loss
If your head is worn and valve stem clearance is excessive boost/drive pressure will pop the seals up eventually.
myother4x4isaCJ7 is online now  
post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-07-2019, 09:43 AM
Cummins Fanatic
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tennessee, on a twisty road north of Smashville
Posts: 155
Thanks: 3
Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
I had my head machined for the new 'top-hat' style seals due to this issue. Sure, it doesn't happen to most folks, but I wanted the reliability.
thor363 is offline  
post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-07-2019, 04:36 PM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by thor363 View Post
I had my head machined for the new 'top-hat' style seals due to this issue. Sure, it doesn't happen to most folks, but I wanted the reliability.
Was the machining required for the new seals? What year 12 valve?
5912valve is offline  
post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-09-2019, 09:03 AM
Cummins Fanatic
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tennessee, on a twisty road north of Smashville
Posts: 155
Thanks: 3
Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5912valve View Post
Was the machining required for the new seals? What year 12 valve?
1995 12 valve and yes the valve guide area needs to be cut down to accommodate, but it wasn't much to do. Had the entire head ported mildly to unshroud below the valves and the guides cut for the new seals, as well as valve job for 500 if I recall correctly. Reassembled with new springs, seals, and retainers/keepers.
thor363 is offline  
post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 07:26 AM
Cummins Enthusiast
 
afterburn549's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 256
Thanks: 14
Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Ideas-
Dont drop the valve when you do this but check the valve to guide clearance.
I would guess there is a high degree of wobble going on?
OR, Maybe -
you have the wrong size / style of stem seals for the guides.

98.5 1 ton Dually -Engine balanced, 275 HP Inj. Ceramic topped pistons with Molly skirts
Mercedes 6 speed, air bags on rear.
Gauges, steel piston squirters
afterburn549 is offline  
post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 01:58 PM
Cummins Fan
 
k9american's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 96
Thanks: 29
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
PDD has a recent video about 60# springs, retainers and locks. They also stock the top hat seals. I saw their video of those seals and don't recall hearing anything about machining the head. I'll have to look for that again. Could be wrong. I'd post links but don't think that's allowed.

'96 2500 4x4 NV4500, boost/pyro, kdp, stock plate fwd, CAI, 4" exhaust, Bilstein shocks, 195k mi. Y->T steering upgrade, SB clutch, etc.
k9american is offline  
post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 05:13 PM
Diesel Head
 
GAmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Killeen, TX
Posts: 15,979
Thanks: 149
Thanked 1,719 Times in 1,505 Posts
iTrader Score: 7 reviews
Videos and links to videos are posted every day.

97 3500, 2 WD, G56, slightly bombed, 1.3 million miles. Started the second million on 8/24/13
If you are lucky enough to be in Texas, you are lucky enough.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 3 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
GAmes is online now  
The Following User Says Thank You to GAmes For This Useful Post:
k9american (05-21-2019)
post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 06:04 PM
The Uppity 12v Guy
 
dauntless89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Cedar City, UT
Posts: 7,657
Thanks: 848
Thanked 1,313 Times in 943 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 1 reviews
Top hat seals don't drop on to factory heads. The stem seal boss needs to be machined but you can do it with a cordless drill and a special cutter with the head off the engine.

'95 2500 ECLB 4x4, 334k and paused due to epic transformation in progress.
dauntless89 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Valve adjustment, oil seals in head? promisedlandorganicfarmer 3rd Gen. Powertrain 16 10-04-2016 06:17 PM
2001 2500: Another bad automatic transmission defdes 911 Urgent Situations 5 01-31-2015 07:41 PM
valve stem seals mowerracer828 98.5-02 Performance Parts Discussion 4 08-20-2014 12:36 PM
head studs and valve seals oldmansimek 94-98 Performance Parts Discussion 12 06-11-2013 04:19 PM
changing valve stem seals... CumminsGermany 3rd Gen. Powertrain 2 03-10-2011 01:23 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome