Pump/Filtration WITHOUT the BS and drama? Independent tests? (FASS, AirDog, Glacier) - Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
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Pump/Filtration WITHOUT the BS and drama? Independent tests? (FASS, AirDog, Glacier)

I'm looking to increase the filtration on my 230K mile 2007 5.9L. Currently have a Smarty Jr., I think set to tow/haul.
No plans in the immediate future for big power (transmissions are too much money)!

I looked up FASS, I looked up Airdog. What I'm finding is a lot of back-and-forth crap and accusations between the companies more than I'm finding helpful information. I don't know what's true, what's not.

I watched a few FASS videos. They do a great job of selling their product. I can't help but wonder if the tests are rigged though.
I found an AirDog video. Mainly just disputing everything that FASS is saying about them. Same thing wondering about tests.

Then there is the Glacier crowd that I found reading through the BS.

I'm not looking for cheerleaders of either company, but facts. No cheerleaders.

FASS goes on about some features and benefits that sound legit in the video, but, whether they actually matter or not, I don't know. Performance Radius Cuts, "polishing" the fuel, among other things.

Are there any independent tests, information, or videos out there? Everything I'm finding is pretty polluted. I know there are owners of all systems who will say "I have XYZ and it works great". That really doesn't sell me on anything though.

I don't know. Just trying to filter through the junk. SEE WHAT I DID THERE.


FASS lays out their "facts" to sell their setups.


FASS-sponsored test that makes AirDog look like garbage:

AirDog "claps back":



Electric Blue '07 Mega 2500 5.9 -- Thuren (3" Coils | Overland Shocks | End Links | Leaf Shackles) | Carli (Track Bar | Ball Joints) | PSC Hydro Assist | Mopar T-style | Metal Cloak +1/2" Control Arms | Fuel Hostage 17x9 -12mm | Toyo M/T 37x13.5-17

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post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 01:23 PM Thread Starter
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Also, does FASS have Minimum Advertised Pricing?
Everywhere I see is $730, but InjectorsDirect lists it for $673 (I checked, they are an Authorized Dealer).

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post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 01:30 PM
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I've had both on different generations of trucks. I had to use Air Dog's warranty once and they were great to work with. My pump failed after 6 years and they replaced it with a new one, just save your receipt. For you needs however, I would just do the Glacier filter.

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post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 01:56 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IH8CALI View Post
I've had both on different generations of trucks. I had to use Air Dog's warranty once and they were great to work with. My pump failed after 6 years and they replaced it with a new one, just save your receipt. For you needs however, I would just do the Glacier filter.
There's someone on here, "utah-something" running a Glacier pump, but then has 5 different filters. That seems a bit crazy and over-the-top to me. I don't know if it's necessary if it can all be self-contained in a FASS or AirDog unit. Being in the NorthEast, the idea of being able to heat it sounds appealing. Don't know if necessary/preferred, or marketing hype. Glacier would be $650 pump kit + $230 Dodge kit ($880) it looks like, plus whatever additional fittings and hoses would be required.


Above-mentioned setup:
Fleetguard FF5079 3/8" Inline Strainer pre-strainer
Mechanical Fuel Boss belt-driven fuel pump
Baldwin BF1212 water/fuel filter, on the rail
Baldwin BF7633 high efficiency fuel spin-on
Baldwin PF7977 in stock canister
Cat UHE 416-1225 Class 8 Ultra High Efficiency, last before CP3

Electric Blue '07 Mega 2500 5.9 -- Thuren (3" Coils | Overland Shocks | End Links | Leaf Shackles) | Carli (Track Bar | Ball Joints) | PSC Hydro Assist | Mopar T-style | Metal Cloak +1/2" Control Arms | Fuel Hostage 17x9 -12mm | Toyo M/T 37x13.5-17

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post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
There's someone on here, "utah-something"
Probably Utah Trapper.

I passed on the glacier pump, just seemed unnecessary to me. Even when the AD pump failed, I still drove home on the CP3 so it's not like it's going to leave you stranded, thus necessitating a mechanical pump. Your in-tank pump is sufficient, you're just trying to provide better filtration so I would do the GDP MK-2 Filter Kit and call it good...unless the time comes where you're wanting to add more power/fuel.
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post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 02:11 PM
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I don’t know why GDP stop selling the Walbro pump kits but I had one on my 03 for 70,000 miles and it worked terrific. I put on a pressure gauge every year when I change the filter and pressure never dropped any from the day it was new.
I put the Walbro pump inside the frame just ahead of the tank so it would be easy to access in case I ever had to replace it. I reused the perfectly good OEM filter and water separator for pre-filtering and added a 2 µm filter ahead of the CP3.
My 2012 already had a fast titanium 95 on it but if it ever goes and I can’t get #Warranty I will put together my own Walbro system. Craig
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post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 02:12 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IH8CALI View Post
Probably Utah Trapper.

I passed on the glacier pump, just seemed unnecessary to me. Even when the AD pump failed, I still drove home on the CP3 so it's not like it's going to leave you stranded, thus necessitating a mechanical pump. Your in-tank pump is sufficient, you're just trying to provide better filtration so I would do the GDP MK-2 Filter Kit and call it good...unless the time comes where you're wanting to add more power/fuel.
The Glacier pump seems more than necessary for what I am looking for at the moment as well. I guess the same could be said for a FASS or AirDog. Although I do like the idea of a refined kit which takes the guesswork out, even if it's a bit more money (Obviously a lot more money than just a simple additional stand-alone filtration kit).

Single 2 micron filter. What's this give you/not give you over the double-filter kits that lot of systems run?

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post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 02:14 PM
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Keep in mind FASS and AD are family. Not figuratively. Literally. They’re father and son companies IIRC. Had a falling out and went their separate ways. So the designs if you find some cutaway schematics are literally as close as they can possibly be to identical without committing patent infringement.

There are a couple other companies out there (Aeromotive, AFE, BD, etc off the top of my head) with some “different” designs but they all basically do exactly the same thing: they suck fuel out of the tank, thru a water separator, push it out of the pump, into and thru a fuel filter, and up to your injection pump.

Then there’s the Fleece in tank replacement dual pump, but it has no additional filtration if that’s important to you.

My two cents is figure out which company gives you the best warm and fuzzy feeling at a price point and warranty you’re comfortable with, and go for it if you need one.


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post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-22-2019, 03:20 PM
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There are no independent tests that I'm aware of. We're left to look at the manufacturer's claims, watch the videos, check the online forums and eventually roll the dice on the setup that we think will work best for us. I chose the FASS Titanium setup. My reasons were: I wanted a setup that was serviceable on the side of the road (frame mounted) if needed without dropping the tank. FASS has a good reputation for reliability in the Class 8 market. Filters were easily cross referenced and available everywhere. Easy access to filters for changes. My diesel mechanic recommended FASS. His family owns a class 8 shop and they have had good luck with FASS - including occasional warranty claims. FASS offers pretty good tech support via a 1-800 number that always gets answered and through a great set of online videos. I like running a two filter setup with a water separator in front with a drain. Same setup as much of the heavy equipment I've operated over the years. The higher volume flow and "fuel polishing" seem to have some merit. Multiple passes though the filter may do a better job of pushing ultra-clean fuel to your injectors.

The cons? Expensive to buy and a bit of work to install. If you run below 1/8 to 1/4 tank, some of these "draw straw" setups will lose prime. Mine does it when I go below 1.8 of a tank on a hill. Truck still runs. The pump just runs noisy and the filters have to be re-primed when you fill up. All the same arguments could probably be made for the Air Dog since it's almost identical. I think the FASS filters may be larger though.

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post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-23-2019, 04:37 AM
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I still run the Glacier Walbro kit, it was the first or second mod I did and was put on at about 3000 miles. It goes through an inline strainer, the factory filter F/W separator then a CAT 1R-0750 filter before the CP3. It runs right at 20 psi continuously. I have a Fleetguard F/W 20 micron frame mount and filter kit that Glacier offered that I never installed.

It's a good simple setup with easily obtained parts that are easy to get to and replace. My only issue is a maybe less than 1/8th tank issue due to the draw straw. If fuel gets low and you stop on a grade it may die due to starvation. I only have ever had it happen one time, just after installation when I only had a few gallons in the tank. I've thought about putting a sump in since they've become available but haven't got around to it.

I've never had to do it, but it is fairly easy to empty the tank by opening the F/W drain and jumping out terminals on the relay so that the pump is powered. I also intend to put a ball valve before the Fleetguard F/W separator whenever I decide to put it on. The way the Glacier setup runs, a bypass goes back to the fill tube, so you can't deadhead the pump and harm it. However, I'd intend to only use this as another antitheft step.

Another great thing about the Walbro is it that fuel can be drawn through. Losing the pump while in operation won't immediately shut the truck off. You can run Duramax style until you can get off the road.

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post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-23-2019, 07:14 AM
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On my 2005 I put together my own filtration system.
I had some parts already like most of the marine fuel hose, and the Detroit Diesel fuel filter base and the aluminum plate for the bracket.
The SS clamps are NORMA from Amazon, solid band, they cant cut the hose. Twin clamps I used on the ss tubing I cut and deburred and no flare needed, the pressures are low here. Why does this site show weird Amazon links?




Added a Cat with 24770 WIX base and WIX filter with a DD base to my truck and kept the stock fuel filter in the middle. Also have a pressure gauge that will tell me if the filters are getting clogged up. I have 2005 DRW 4door 3500 with 162,000 miles.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/oBQ4Hv2qaTrJwv6z7

Important to note, the aluminum Cat filter really needs a non aluminum thread nipple on the filter base, or it can jam and weld together.
I made my own bracket for it to fit after the OEM filter. And rebent the OEM fuel pipe from CP3 pump to reuse for the CAT filter.
There is a better Ultra High Efficiency CAT filter 416-1225 or UHE 319-0844 to replace the 1R0750 which I will use someday, it will fit on same base.

You should really use a UHE filter, not an AHE, better micron rating. I see those kits all use the inferior AHE filters.
Unfortunately I learned that after buying the AHE 1R0750, but I can replace it with a UHE, as it will screw on the same base.

I can also replace the WIX 33118 with a water separating WIX 33418, and the Detroit Diesel base can take many different filters, it has 1 -12 steel threads. It is a real strong solid base. 2 thru bolts into the frame, plus I had to reposition the SS fuel tubing lower to create a space for it.
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post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-23-2019, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveB.inVa View Post
I still run the Glacier Walbro kit, it was the first or second mod I did and was put on at about 3000 miles. It goes through an inline strainer, the factory filter F/W separator then a CAT 1R-0750 filter before the CP3. It runs right at 20 psi continuously. I have a Fleetguard F/W 20 micron frame mount and filter kit that Glacier offered that I never installed.

It's a good simple setup with easily obtained parts that are easy to get to and replace. My only issue is a maybe less than 1/8th tank issue due to the draw straw. If fuel gets low and you stop on a grade it may die due to starvation. I only have ever had it happen one time, just after installation when I only had a few gallons in the tank. I've thought about putting a sump in since they've become available but haven't got around to it.

I've never had to do it, but it is fairly easy to empty the tank by opening the F/W drain and jumping out terminals on the relay so that the pump is powered. I also intend to put a ball valve before the Fleetguard F/W separator whenever I decide to put it on. The way the Glacier setup runs, a bypass goes back to the fill tube, so you can't deadhead the pump and harm it. However, I'd intend to only use this as another antitheft step.

Another great thing about the Walbro is it that fuel can be drawn through. Losing the pump while in operation won't immediately shut the truck off. You can run Duramax style until you can get off the road.

i also run a walbro glacier kit and have a vulcan 3 mic fuel filter kit under the intake elbow. i still use the oem filter and its water separater with the baldwin 7977 (?) filter. i also have the low fuel issue and have a beans sump on the shelf waiting to go in.

i took the KISS route and have had the first pump fail at ~20k miles and only found it cause of a fuel filter change. Could not reprime the system to fire it back up.

i also have the fuel strainer in front if it and swap that filter out every 35-40k miles. current pump was swapped in at ~205k, truck now has 423k. pump sounds like crap now for a couple of years but continues to work. truck is a daily driver, self tuned for mpg, never tows and hauls an occasional load without complaints.

if you need more fuel than the walbro can provide, there js the bosch 044...

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