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ChfEngr 07-16-2019 10:05 AM

Buying New?
 
I'm looking to get rid of my 2014 3500 Longhorn DRW w/ 82k miles and step up to a 2019 2500 Megacab b/c my needs have changed (move to a more urban area) and the 'new' creature comforts offered in the 2019 models. I'm willing to spend $30k out-the-door for the upgrade but not a penny more. However, the best prices I've gotten from a few stealerships all flirted around $36k--which I refuse to pay b/c my 1-ton sells for ~$45k all day long on the Internet and I'd be stupid to give any dealership a free $10k on my well-taken-care-of dually to proverbially downgrade to a 3/4 ton.

You guys have any recommendations in the Oklahoma/Texas area that may be willing to get a heck of a lot closer to my hard $30k OOD price? I'm willing to travel up to 1000 miles to make the deal for the truck I want.

EricPeterson 07-16-2019 10:31 AM

Sounds like you're planning to trade-in. Don't. Sell the old truck on your own. You'll come out ahead. Yeah...it's a pain. The dealerships count on it being a pain, which is why they give you so little for your trade. You'll have to find something else to drive between the trucks, or take a break from working with the truck.

When the dealership takes a trade-in, they're not sure whether they'll sell it or wholesale it. That decision is made AFTER they put your trade-in up on the lift and start checking it over in detail, after they own in. They price the trade-in to guarantee they make the bucks no matter what... even if they take a bath on wholesaling it to an auction house. Go to the KBB and NADA pricing sites and check the value of your truck ... trade-in, private party, and dealer-used. You'll see a huge difference between the three expected values/prices.

Negotiating to a trade-in differential is like negotiating to a monthly payment. There are too many parameters out of your immediate control or too many things the seller can tweak to screw you over. There's only one way to buy a vehicle from a position of negotiating strength -- no trade, and cash ... or at least a bank or credit union site draft ... in hand.

JMHO.

ChfEngr 07-16-2019 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricPeterson (Post 29032927)
Sounds like you're planning to trade-in. Don't. Sell the old truck on your own. You'll come out ahead. Yeah...it's a pain. The dealerships count on it being a pain, which is why they give you so little for your trade. You'll have to find something else to drive between the trucks, or take a break from working with the truck.

When the dealership takes a trade-in, they're not sure whether they'll sell it or wholesale it. That decision is made AFTER they put your trade-in up on the lift and start checking it over in detail, after they own in. They price the trade-in to guarantee they make the bucks no matter what... even if they take a bath on wholesaling it to an auction house. Go to the KBB and NADA pricing sites and check the value of your truck ... trade-in, private party, and dealer-used. You'll see a huge difference between the three expected values/prices.

Negotiating to a trade-in differential is like negotiating to a monthly payment. There are too many parameters out of your immediate control or too many things the seller can tweak to screw you over. There's only one way to buy a vehicle from a position of negotiating strength -- no trade, and cash ... or at least a bank or credit union site draft ... in hand.

JMHO.

Have you sold personally before? If so, what website(s) did you find gave your the broadest exposure?

EricPeterson 07-16-2019 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChfEngr (Post 29032959)
Have you sold personally before? If so, what website(s) did you find gave your the broadest exposure?

Yup.

When I sold my first Ranger, I advertised it in the classifieds of the San Antonio newspaper and in AutoTrader. AutoTrader customer bought it. Cash sale.

My second Ranger I didn't get to sell. A 17-year-old driving an F650 landscaping truck wiped it out. Me, too, almost.

When I sold my F150, I advertised it on an F150 forum's classified area, Craigslist, and on ebay. The sale lead came through CL, local. Almost missed it among all the please-I-must-pay-with-a-fake-check-for-too-much-money scams. Watch out for those, but they're easy to spot. The buyer is always desperate, always works only through email, and always asks you to shut down your advert immediately. You'll get three or four as soon as the ad posts, all through text messages. I had a number of inquiries through the F150 forum and a couple through ebay. Sold too quickly to follow-up with any of those online interests. It was a clean V6 4-speed manual regular cab work truck with rubber floors and low miles -- not common at all. IIRC, the F150's expected dealer price was about $7000, the private party sale price about $6400, and the trade-in value about $4500. Did the deal at the buyer's credit union. Buyer wanted his son to learn how to drive a manual, and didn't want the kid driving a vehicle with much power. Perfect!

ChfEngr 07-16-2019 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricPeterson (Post 29032975)
Yup.

When I sold my first Ranger, I advertised it in the classifieds of the San Antonio newspaper and in AutoTrader. AutoTrader customer bought it. Cash sale.

My second Ranger I didn't get to sell. A 17-year-old driving an F650 landscaping truck wiped it out. Me, too, almost.

When I sold my F150, I advertised it on an F150 forum's classified area, Craigslist, and on ebay. The sale lead came through CL, local. Almost missed it among all the please-I-must-pay-with-a-fake-check-for-too-much-money scams. Watch out for those, but they're easy to spot. The buyer is always desperate, always works only through email, and always asks you to shut down your advert immediately. You'll get three or four as soon as the ad posts, all through text messages. I had a number of inquiries through the F150 forum and a couple through ebay. Sold too quickly to follow-up with any of those online interests. It was a clean V6 4-speed manual regular cab work truck with rubber floors and low miles -- not common at all. IIRC, the F150's expected dealer price was about $7000, the private party sale price about $6400, and the trade-in value about $4500. Did the deal at the buyer's credit union. Buyer wanted his son to learn how to drive a manual, and didn't want the kid driving a vehicle with much power. Perfect!

Thanks, Eric.

I've just listed on CL ($5) and it appears autotrader and the others I'm coming across charge for the listing. I'll give it a few days on CL and see what happens before I just dump a bunch of money into advertising. Either way, I'm sure I can do better than the low-ball $35k offer of the dealer!

AirGrabber 07-16-2019 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChfEngr (Post 29032917)
I'm looking to get rid of my 2014 3500 Longhorn DRW w/ 82k miles and step up to a 2019 2500 Megacab b/c my needs have changed (move to a more urban area) and the 'new' creature comforts offered in the 2019 models. I'm willing to spend $30k out-the-door for the upgrade but not a penny more. However, the best prices I've gotten from a few stealerships all flirted around $36k--which I refuse to pay b/c my 1-ton sells for ~$45k all day long on the Internet and I'd be stupid to give any dealership a free $10k on my well-taken-care-of dually to proverbially downgrade to a 3/4 ton.

You guys have any recommendations in the Oklahoma/Texas area that may be willing to get a heck of a lot closer to my hard $30k OOD price? I'm willing to travel up to 1000 miles to make the deal for the truck I want.


A 14 longhorn might be listed for sale at a dealer for 45 which is the higher end of the spectrum. But when you can get left over 18's new for mid 50's why would someone bite at a 89000 mile used truck for 45? Logically youd get around 40 for it outright. Maybe more if someone just had to have yours. Dealers have the ability to get more as they offer more choices and incentives, warrantys, financing ect.. to make the deal happen.
You were at 35 trade in...right? Plus the trade tax break on difference so call it roughly 37000.
So basically your looking at 3k-5k to gain by selling outright....a little more if your lucky. Ebay, craigslist, facebook classifieds, and in classified section here are a good place to start. Cant hurt but to try.
Also couldn't hurt to try to negotiate the new truck some more and the amount they'll give you on trade for yours.

EricPeterson 07-16-2019 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChfEngr (Post 29032989)
Thanks, Eric.

I've just listed on CL ($5) and it appears autotrader and the others I'm coming across charge for the listing. I'll give it a few days on CL and see what happens before I just dump a bunch of money into advertising. Either way, I'm sure I can do better than the low-ball $35k offer of the dealer!

Exactly. The model year changeover is looming, so orders are restricted, and dealers are still treating the new trucks like gold. There are heavy discounts on leftover 2018s, but the stock is starting to thin and that's still lots more money. You'll always do better than trade-in!

ChfEngr 07-16-2019 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AirGrabber (Post 29032995)
A 14 longhorn might be listed for sale at a dealer for 45 which is the higher end of the spectrum. But when you can get left over 18's new for mid 50's why would someone bite at a 89000 mile used truck for 45? Logically youd get around 40 for it outright. Maybe more if someone just had to have yours. Dealers have the ability to get more as they offer more choices and incentives, warrantys, financing ect.. to make the deal happen.
You were at 35 trade in...right? Plus the trade tax break on difference so call it roughly 37000.
So basically your looking at 3k-5k to gain by selling outright....a little more if your lucky. Ebay, craigslist, facebook classifieds, and in classified section here are a good place to start. Cant hurt but to try.
Also couldn't hurt to try to negotiate the new truck some more and the amount they'll give you on trade for yours.

Realistically looking to get $40k-$43k in a private sale. Points taken.

EricPeterson 07-16-2019 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AirGrabber (Post 29032995)
Also couldn't hurt to try to negotiate the new truck some more and the amount they'll give you on trade for yours.

Heh. Years and years ago I had the opportunity to watch an old hand negotiate a new car purchase. I got to go along for the educational value, specifically. It was a rainy Wednesday morning near the end of the month. The dealership was dead. The (presumed) trade-in was a creampuff, babied Caddy... but the guy really had no intention of trading it in. He maneuvered the dealer by talking trade-in in general only, then said he wanted to deal only on the new sale first, "to see where I stand", letting the saleman assume he'd make up more profit on the trade. So they (negotiated -- apparently the autocensor doesn't like the word I used) ****ered for a while, the buyer all hesitant and cautious, and salesman playing the I've-got-to-clear-this-with-the-boss schtick a couple times. Finally there was a binding sale order with a cash price on the desk signed by the sales manager, and the buyer grabbed it and signed it....

So the salesman sits back, all happy, and says "OK! Now let's deal on the trade-in!"

And my stepdad's buddy says "What trade-in?

It was all well and truly a thing of beauty.

AirGrabber 07-16-2019 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricPeterson (Post 29033043)
So they (negotiated -- apparently the autocensor doesn't like the word I used) ****ered for a while, the buyer all hesitant and cautious, and salesman playing the I've-got-to-clear-this-with-the-boss schtick a couple times. Finally there was a binding sale order with a cash price on the desk signed by the sales manager, and the buyer grabbed it and signed it....

So the salesman sits back, all happy, and says "OK! Now let's deal on the trade-in!"

And my stepdad's buddy says "What trade-in?

It was all well and truly a thing of beauty.

That's a good one.

And the dealer got a signed agreement and still made out considerably. Salesman just used a little Lidocaine to numb things up a bit so there was no loud singing of MoonRiver…

EricPeterson 07-16-2019 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AirGrabber (Post 29033067)
That's a good one.

And the dealer got a signed agreement and still made out considerably. Salesman just used a little Lidocaine to numb things up a bit so there was no loud singing of MoonRiver…

Sure, dealer still made money -- just not as much as he had expected/hoped/wanted to. They're never going to make any deal -- or half of any deal -- that sums to a loss. The trick is getting the dealer to that point where he's just barely willing to close.

And then, of course, ya gotta make sure there's no $900 dealer prep package in the fine print under the $500 pin stripes.....

AirGrabber 07-16-2019 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricPeterson (Post 29033075)
Sure, dealer still made money -- just not as much as he had expected/hoped/wanted to. They're never going to make any deal -- or half of any deal -- that sums to a loss. The trick is getting the dealer to that point where he's just barely willing to close.

And then, of course, ya gotta make sure there's no $900 dealer prep package in the fine print under the $500 pin stripes.....


It sounds as he made out pretty well there.

Just imagine how many people don't make the effort or try to negotiate, or don't do their homework on values ect.. Even at best number for new and best number for trade a dealer makes a good profit. Anything above is gravy. Everyones gotta be happy with the sale/purchase. Some don't pay enough attention to how much they are actually handing the dealer and fall for the smoke and mirrors..


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