Shifting style on manual trans. - Page 6

rolland40 · 11-06-2009, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JasonY

Generally you *should* always use the clutch on a synchronized transmission, doesnt mean you have to. but it only takes a few mis shifts to really take a toll on the teeth of the synchro.

Jason

synchros DONT have teeth, a synchro is basically a small clutch to match the rpm of the 2 gears before the teeth engage on the shaft so it wont grind.

Dracozny · 11-07-2009, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rolland40

synchros DONT have teeth, a synchro is basically a small clutch to match the rpm of the 2 gears before the teeth engage on the shaft so it wont grind.

they look toothed to me
Rebuilding an NV4500 Manual Transmission - Four Wheeler Magazine

__________________
1999 2500 Laramie 4x4, Longbed, nv4500, goose neck hitch, boost/pyro gauges, raptor 100.

rolland40 · 11-07-2009, 12:27 AM

if those are teeth then why doesnt it grind, you can see a friction material on the inside of those rings, the teeth fix the synchro to the gear

Last edited by rolland40 : 11-07-2009 at 12:35 AM.

JasonY · 11-07-2009, 12:59 AM

The synchronizer ring (#7) in the diagram is what is normally called a synchro ring - it's the part that usually wears out. The synchronizer sleeve of the synchronizer (#1) slides back and forth on the synchronizer hub (#3), which is the part that is attached to the output shaft by he barely visible splines on the inner diameter. The synchro ring (#7) "rides" on the conical shaped part (#6) of the gear (# 5). When you shift into a gear, the synchronizer sleeve (#1) is moved toward the gear (#5). As it moves, the small teeth (#9) engage the teeth (#4) on the synchro ring, which causes the synchro ring to rotate at the same rate as the synchronizer assembly (#1 & #3) which are splined to each other as well as the output shaft. As synchronizer sleeve (#1) continues to move toward the gear, the inside of the synchro ring (#7) is pressed up against the conical shaped part of the gear. This causes the gear to match speed with the synchronizer, and once the speeds are matched, the synchronizer sleeve continues to slide toward the gear, engaging the teeth on the side of the gear.

from:
How a Transmission Works

Great write up on how a standard box works.

Jason

__________________
2001.5 Ext. Cab Short bed 4X4-315 BFG AT's/AEM HD intake/MBRP 4"/Silencer ring M.I.A/Raptor 100/new VP44/Mag deep trans pan/Edge EZ/RV275's/Quad Commander/Kool-Vue power/heated tow mirrors

Last edited by JasonY : 11-07-2009 at 01:01 AM.

JD3500 · 11-07-2009, 11:25 AM

I use the clutch in my pickup truck.

I never use the truck on the kenworth, or any of our other big rigs. its a good way to screw up soem synchro's

__________________
1999 3500 DRW. New Holley Blue lift, and VP44

stock. BHAF, Straight Pipe. Plans for Fass gauges and chip. Pulls 33ft alumascape 5er

Ops · 11-07-2009, 05:41 PM

If you do it right, no harm will be done. If you are doing it right, you can shift gears with one or two fingers.

Been a while since I had a stickshift in my own vehicle, but I floated them all the time, never blew a manual trans in any truck I've owned.

Ops

__________________
01 QC, tow package, 4X4, Edge EZ, 4:10s with LS, 5" straight pipe. DSS steering brace, AGR steering box. Holley Black on the frame rail, ISSPRO fuel pressure guage. Heachache rack, brush guard, 100w driving lights. Goerend triple disc and VB.

Dracozny · 11-08-2009, 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD3500

I use the clutch in my pickup truck.

I never use the truck on the kenworth, or any of our other big rigs. its a good way to screw up soem synchro's

I swear its like talking to a dozen brick walls.

__________________
1999 2500 Laramie 4x4, Longbed, nv4500, goose neck hitch, boost/pyro gauges, raptor 100.

cLaYtoNs CuMMin · 11-09-2009, 01:12 AM

Using no clutch is meant for big semi trucks with tranny's as big as a house! But hey, cant find em, grind em.

__________________

2002 5.9 2500 QC 4x4 Auto, all stock

lbdodge24v · 11-09-2009, 08:43 PM

Good info here, and opinions. Since everything in mine is new, and it hurt the pocket when it was all paid, I use the clutch for now, can't see where i can go wrong doing that. But somewhere back a few pages, someone said something about a dual disc clutch when floating the gears. Would a dual disc make any difference in diong this or not?

On to the new problems with it though. LOL

__________________
02 Dodge Ram CTD, 6 spd. with some power adder parts.
The Toy: 93 Jeep Wrangler, rolling on 44 in Boggers, powered by a Cummins with some smoke !!

Dracozny · 11-09-2009, 08:46 PM

shifting clutchless is the same with a dual disk, and more of a reason to since the tension on that clutch pedal is considerably more

__________________
1999 2500 Laramie 4x4, Longbed, nv4500, goose neck hitch, boost/pyro gauges, raptor 100.

lbdodge24v · 11-09-2009, 10:23 PM

Just was asking, mine is actually about the same with the dual disk as it was, but it has always had a stiff pedal, now if the rims would stop cracking.

__________________
02 Dodge Ram CTD, 6 spd. with some power adder parts.
The Toy: 93 Jeep Wrangler, rolling on 44 in Boggers, powered by a Cummins with some smoke !!

BlackedOut02 · 11-10-2009, 01:04 AM

no clutch = no syncros

found that out the hard way

__________________

'02 | 2WD | 2500 | NV4500

"Diesels dont run away. Diesels over speed, mechanics run away"

View Poll Results: How do you shift?
Use Clutch for every shift	136	73.91%
No clutch for shifting	48	26.09%
Voters: 184. You may not vote on this poll

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Remove Advertisements Sponsored Links
Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum Advertisement

11-07-2009, 12:27 AM	#63 (permalink)
rolland40 Cummins Fan Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 36 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts rolland40's Truck Pics	if those are teeth then why doesnt it grind, you can see a friction material on the inside of those rings, the teeth fix the synchro to the gear Last edited by rolland40 : 11-07-2009 at 12:35 AM.

11-07-2009, 12:59 AM	#64 (permalink)
JasonY Cummins Nut Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Delaware Posts: 335 Thanks: 1 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts JasonY's Truck Pics	The synchronizer ring (#7) in the diagram is what is normally called a synchro ring - it's the part that usually wears out. The synchronizer sleeve of the synchronizer (#1) slides back and forth on the synchronizer hub (#3), which is the part that is attached to the output shaft by he barely visible splines on the inner diameter. The synchro ring (#7) "rides" on the conical shaped part (#6) of the gear (# 5). When you shift into a gear, the synchronizer sleeve (#1) is moved toward the gear (#5). As it moves, the small teeth (#9) engage the teeth (#4) on the synchro ring, which causes the synchro ring to rotate at the same rate as the synchronizer assembly (#1 & #3) which are splined to each other as well as the output shaft. As synchronizer sleeve (#1) continues to move toward the gear, the inside of the synchro ring (#7) is pressed up against the conical shaped part of the gear. This causes the gear to match speed with the synchronizer, and once the speeds are matched, the synchronizer sleeve continues to slide toward the gear, engaging the teeth on the side of the gear. from: How a Transmission Works Great write up on how a standard box works. Jason __________________ 2001.5 Ext. Cab Short bed 4X4-315 BFG AT's/AEM HD intake/MBRP 4"/Silencer ring M.I.A/Raptor 100/new VP44/Mag deep trans pan/Edge EZ/RV275's/Quad Commander/Kool-Vue power/heated tow mirrors Last edited by JasonY : 11-07-2009 at 01:01 AM.

11-07-2009, 11:25 AM	#65 (permalink)
JD3500 Newbie Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 11 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts JD3500's Truck Pics	I use the clutch in my pickup truck. I never use the truck on the kenworth, or any of our other big rigs. its a good way to screw up soem synchro's __________________ 1999 3500 DRW. New Holley Blue lift, and VP44 stock. BHAF, Straight Pipe. Plans for Fass gauges and chip. Pulls 33ft alumascape 5er

11-07-2009, 05:41 PM	#66 (permalink)
Ops Diesel Freak Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Middle of PA Posts: 588 Thanks: 3 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts Ops's Truck Pics	If you do it right, no harm will be done. If you are doing it right, you can shift gears with one or two fingers. Been a while since I had a stickshift in my own vehicle, but I floated them all the time, never blew a manual trans in any truck I've owned. Ops __________________ 01 QC, tow package, 4X4, Edge EZ, 4:10s with LS, 5" straight pipe. DSS steering brace, AGR steering box. Holley Black on the frame rail, ISSPRO fuel pressure guage. Heachache rack, brush guard, 100w driving lights. Goerend triple disc and VB.

11-09-2009, 01:12 AM	#68 (permalink)
cLaYtoNs CuMMin Newbie Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ft. Collins, CO Posts: 6 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts cLaYtoNs CuMMin's Truck Pics	Using no clutch is meant for big semi trucks with tranny's as big as a house! But hey, cant find em, grind em. __________________ 2002 5.9 2500 QC 4x4 Auto, all stock

11-09-2009, 08:43 PM	#69 (permalink)
lbdodge24v Cummins Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 145 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts lbdodge24v's Truck Pics	Good info here, and opinions. Since everything in mine is new, and it hurt the pocket when it was all paid, I use the clutch for now, can't see where i can go wrong doing that. But somewhere back a few pages, someone said something about a dual disc clutch when floating the gears. Would a dual disc make any difference in diong this or not? On to the new problems with it though. LOL __________________ 02 Dodge Ram CTD, 6 spd. with some power adder parts. The Toy: 93 Jeep Wrangler, rolling on 44 in Boggers, powered by a Cummins with some smoke !!

11-09-2009, 08:46 PM	#70 (permalink)
Dracozny Diesel Freak Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Linn County, Oregon Posts: 614 Thanks: 3 Thanked 36 Times in 35 Posts Dracozny's Truck Pics	shifting clutchless is the same with a dual disk, and more of a reason to since the tension on that clutch pedal is considerably more __________________ 1999 2500 Laramie 4x4, Longbed, nv4500, goose neck hitch, boost/pyro gauges, raptor 100.

11-09-2009, 10:23 PM	#71 (permalink)
lbdodge24v Cummins Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 145 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts lbdodge24v's Truck Pics	Just was asking, mine is actually about the same with the dual disk as it was, but it has always had a stiff pedal, now if the rims would stop cracking. __________________ 02 Dodge Ram CTD, 6 spd. with some power adder parts. The Toy: 93 Jeep Wrangler, rolling on 44 in Boggers, powered by a Cummins with some smoke !!

11-10-2009, 01:04 AM	#72 (permalink)
BlackedOut02 Diesel Head Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: In the Effin Getto, LA Posts: 2,497 Thanks: 38 Thanked 56 Times in 42 Posts BlackedOut02's Truck Pics	no clutch = no syncros found that out the hard way __________________ '02 \| 2WD \| 2500 \| NV4500 "Diesels dont run away. Diesels over speed, mechanics run away"