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24v Cummins

2K views 28 replies 9 participants last post by  justanotherwhitedodge 
#1 ·
Torn between doing a p-pump swap or keeping the vp. I like the fact of having a push button power. But also like the fact of the reliability of the p7100. When I travel I go hundreds of miles with a camper and don't want to be stranded on the side of the road. I only want about 450-500hp. I have a fass 150(love it). Just trying to decide before I put truck on the road. Ohh and I don't have to worry about emissions. Would like to keep the 44 but want reliability to. Thanks y'all


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#3 ·
From my perspective... If i had the budget, i would already be ppump swapped, and its nothing to take a bulb out of the cluster. And i will do it when money allows. Although neither of my vp44 trucks have given me ANY fits as far as engine trouble since both trucks were fed more than enough constant fuel. And im only p7100 swapping because i want to never have to have that in the back my mind "when am i gonna have to drop a grand on a new vp44 and is it gonna leave me stranded hundreds of miles from home". Though my truck is mechanically reliable, its the 'what if' factor that gets me. Dont get me wrong, I would jump in my truck and take it anywhere. Just that darn what if...
 
#4 ·
Every vehicle has the "what if" ... thats life.


After several thoughts of PPumping a VP...you actually lose far more than what is at eyes length. Dynamic timing, cruise function among other items...are just a few debateable points.
 
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#5 ·
Stormin08, oh i know its more lost than gained. And im one of those people that tries to justify mods. The allure of crankin up a ppump and making more power than a vp44 can has always been something i wanted. Although it is probably way more than i would ever need and a vp44 can max out pretty well. But who knows how long a turned up vp will last. Or the rest of my truck for that matter. Lol
 
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#6 · (Edited)
im only p7100 swapping because i want to never have to have that in the back my mind "when am i gonna have to drop a grand on a new vp44 and is it gonna leave me stranded hundreds of miles from home".
LOL... I'm more remote that you are. I live in an area without cell service. I've got over 234k miles on my VP44 still doing just fine. Still, in all, you'll give up that dynamic timing for fixed timing of the P7100 and also take a good hit to MPG once you do convert over. I've never seen anyone yet ever gain MPG swapping from VP44 to P7100. You might gain more HP but in the end game, the operational cost will be more. Better yet my current life has me driving 362 miles every other day. Am I afraid of failure? No. Will I make 300k on this VP44 pump not a problem I plan on it!

More or less like taking efficient electronic fuel injection off a car to drop on a carburetor. Yes, the HP/TQ gain will be there but the efficiency will be lost.
 
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#7 ·
Im really more concerned with the dainty sensitive electronics on these trucks. Not necessarily the mechaincal operation of the vp44. If something goes it on my truck its more than likely something I cant fix by smacking it with a hammer. If i had the money to do the swap i would. Till then ill enjoy my vp44. Hell ill probably replace it with a reman before i ever do a p7100, because the reliability of the newer ones seems to be very very good. But since i dont have any back history on the pump who knows.
 
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#8 ·
So what I have read so far is that the vp is pretty reliable (read forums all day literally not lie) it's the lift pump (have a fass). It's may daily and I just need reliability and pretty quick. My other question is when I do start cranking her up will I have to worry about it or is it just another part.


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#9 ·
I feel exactly the same way - I'd like to P-pump my truck for the sole reason of eliminating the electronics in the VP44. I know it wouldn't be as efficient. I've never said I wanted to do it to increase MPG... I really wanted a 12 valve for that reason, I only bought a 24 because I couldn't find a clean enough "holy grail" 1998 12 valve 4x4 dually with the opening rear doors. 24 valves like that are everywhere and you can be picky and find a really nice one.

Having said that, my situation is like MoparMan's, I run a good lift pump and 2-cycle oil and really haven't had trouble with the VP - and the tuning available by using the Quadzilla Adrenaline is great.
I like the high idle warmup mode, the automatic (but determined by me) fuel cutoff if EGT gets too high and other cool stuff that only computerized vehicles can have.

But on a road trip, I do have that creepy feeling - the one I spent all this money on this diesel to try to not have.
 
#11 ·
So it seems that you are pretty washy about what you want to do with your truck. a few days ago it was should "I sell because of frame damage". I know prior I have seen you post other similar questions.

What I would do if I was you is sit down and decide what direction you want to go in for the truck. We can't offer you advise if you are waffling back and forth.

is the p710 a good pump? Yes it is a good pump
is the VP44 a goog pump? Yes it is a good pump

Are they the same? No they are different, both have strong points and draw backs. For me reliabity is not a reason to go with a p7100. A modern VP44 is considered reliable. Keep in mind that lots of us have north of 100,000 even 200,000 on an injection pump. Is any part that last more than 100,000 really that unreliable? "Man I only got 100,000 miles out of my unit bearings" people don't yell and scream unreliable, they say, "yea that's about what they last."

How many 2nd gen trucks do you see on the side of the road? It's not like the vp44 just up and decides to quit the vast majority of the time. Normally you have signs, codes, etc. Replace the part when it goes bad and move on with your life. if you try to plan for the worst and work towards making your entire truck bulletproof, it will never leave jackstands. Just drive the stupid thing.


As a side note if you are needing to be worried about anything on your truck I would be worried about that K & N filter that you have....They are garbage. You are worring about a VP44 when you are literally running an air filter that doesn't filter....:banghead:

K&N Air Filter Review - Debunking the Myths (and why OEM is better)





 
#12 ·
So it seems that you are pretty washy about what you want to do with your truck. a few days ago it was should "I sell because of frame damage". I know prior I have seen you post other similar questions.



What I would do if I was you is sit down and decide what direction you want to go in for the truck. We can't offer you advise if you are waffling back and forth.



is the p710 a good pump? Yes it is a good pump

is the VP44 a goog pump? Yes it is a good pump



Are they the same? No they are different, both have strong points and draw backs. For me reliabity is not a reason to go with a p7100. A modern VP44 is considered reliable. Keep in mind that lots of us have north of 100,000 even 200,000 on an injection pump. Is any part that last more than 100,000 really that unreliable? "Man I only got 100,000 miles out of my unit bearings" people don't yell and scream unreliable, they say, "yea that's about what they last."



How many 2nd gen trucks do you see on the side of the road? It's not like the vp44 just up and decides to quit the vast majority of the time. Normally you have signs, codes, etc. Replace the part when it goes bad and move on with your life. if you try to plan for the worst and work towards making your entire truck bulletproof, it will never leave jackstands. Just drive the stupid thing.





As a side note if you are needing to be worried about anything on your truck I would be worried about that K & N filter that you have....They are garbage. You are worring about a VP44 when you are literally running an air filter that doesn't filter....:banghead:



K&N Air Filter Review - Debunking the Myths (and why OEM is better)













It's not that I'm really worried I'm just trying to summarize things up. I'm in the process of getting a new air filter it's just what came with the truck


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#13 ·
The more i learn about how fragile the electronics are on these trucks the more i want ppump swap. Alternator putting out "ac noise"? Could hurt ecm/vp. Fuel pressure gets to low without being addressed? Kills vp quickly. Forget to unplug 600$ tuner when jumping the truck off? Fried tuner. Let off throttle too quickly at high rpm? airlocked vp. I could go on and on. Just my 2 cents, i will ppump my truck as soon as i have the funds because that gets rid of the entire what if factor as far as the motor goes.
 
#17 ·
My thoughts exactly. I check this forum every single day and have to scroll throuth tons of "my truck runs weird" "my truck wont start" "my truck is smoking" "my truck died" "my 47re shifts stupid" "is my vp44 bad".... I have to search through an eternity of bad alternator threads and which fuel pump for a newbie to buy just to find any sort of info i need. This forum is more of a help desk for people with no common sense. Especially since there are literally hundreds of threads on those same topics. P7100 and done. If i was concerned with mpg i would buy a civic...
 
#15 ·
Or just check on you're alt ac noise and address if needed? Then keep the benefits of the vp44 efficiency?

Everything need maintenance in some way or another
If that was the only problem that could potentially happen it wouldn't be a big deal. Its the exhausted list of things that alot of people would never even think to check that gets me. Then again Im after big power AND reliability. Different things fit different peoples needs/wants
 
#18 ·
Just because you p-pump the truck doesn't resolve the rest of the electronics. You still have the ECM, PCM and ABS etc. Yeah, you might not have the VP44 failures but you'll still have ECM and PCM failures. Bad part is Auto's require the ECM and PCM for communication of engine data. So is it easier to repalce a alternator or completely change over for p-pump that doesn't resolve the AC noise issues yet...You can still have ECM / PCM failures... Hmmmm...

As for performance and racing I will still have to say P7100 is the best pump for that... I'm not going to argue that point...
 
#19 ·
Couple of points to remember:

1. Mostly people use these forums to get help with problems they are having with their trucks. People are not going to come on here just to write how much they love their trucks and how reliable and happy they are. So yes, when searching ANY forum, you are going to see mostly troubles/problems.

2. PPump only fixes the VP "issue". You will still have the potential AC noise and electronics problems because they are still controlling the rest of your truck like your AC, battery charging, shifting, cruise, among other things.

3. These trucks are anywhere from 15-19 years old. No matter what you do, there will be issues that always require maintenance.

4. Hurts resale value. I would never buy a PPumped truck because you have no idea what kind of job that person did on the conversion. How bad did they beat the truck after they ppumped it?

Don't get me wrong, I would love to PPump my truck, just as a fun project to do, but never as an "improvement" over what I have. If I were going to tackle a fun project, I would do something like this:
 
#21 ·
Couple of points to remember:

1. Mostly people use these forums to get help with problems they are having with their trucks. People are not going to come on here just to write how much they love their trucks and how reliable and happy they are. So yes, when searching ANY forum, you are going to see mostly troubles/problems.
*takes more time to create a profile to log in and post the questions rather than search in the first place.*

2. PPump only fixes the VP "issue". You will still have the potential AC noise and electronics problems because they are still controlling the rest of your truck like your AC, battery charging, shifting, cruise, among other things.
*true, but a p7100 will RUN the truck regardless of electrical issues. So maybe the alt kills the pcm, but you can drop it into manual 1st on the auto and it will still go. Vp44 quits and youre dead in the water*

3. These trucks are anywhere from 15-19 years old. No matter what you do, there will be issues that always require maintenance.
*that means theres almost 20yrs of info floating around on this free resource that some users are either too lazy or simply dont kniw how to use.*

4. Hurts resale value. I would never buy a PPumped truck because you have no idea what kind of job that person did on the conversion. How bad did they beat the truck after they ppumped it?
*how bad to people beat ANY used cummins. chances are its been given the beans regardless of what pump is on it! Everyone loves to just press a button on the comp box and run the vp44 wide open where as most ppumped 24vs cant ever even get timing dialed in, chances are they never even made any real power to begin with. Atleast all the ones ive seen locally.*
 
#20 ·
There is no resale value of my truck. I would be better off keeping it and making it what i want than trying to sell to people who offer less than trade in value for the darn thing. I would get more satisfaction taking a sledge to it than selling it to a lowballer.
 
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