Veggie conversion

[svoram]

First off, this ain't for everyone. If you are not enough of a geek to build your own veggie system, you probably are not a good candidate for a veggie bomber. Also, I don't care to argue whether this is safe. Use an older truck where you don't have much to loose. Don't risk a new 2010 Ram to save a few hundred bucks in fuel. Trust me, new electronic injection systems don't like veggie oil.

Second point- Veggie oil is the viscosity of diesel at 300F. It has to be at least 150F at the IP or you are taking a huge risk. I know alot of people that had a proffesionaly installed system ruin thier motor in 10K miles. Kits are useful but you still have to understand physics and thermodynamics from firsthand tinkering- not a college course.

Third point- you need to get together with some friends and form a veggie aquistion team. It has to be good quality, dry and filtered. Nice thing about a truck- you can put a huge tank in the bed!

Let's start with my home made system. Wether or not you use veggie oil, you want a 2 tank system anyhow. You can use the recirc as a carbon purge and various service issues can be addressed. So this is stuff you need reguardless. The fuel heater is neededed in cold climates anyhow. Now, lets start with the engine compartment. Hopefully my pcture helps. Get 2 top line 3 way solenoid valves, don't mess with cheapo pollock valves. Then some fuel line, some wire and a couple of switches. So now your in this a couple hundred. Dodge really made it hard to get behind the fuel filter. Now, you first need a recirc valve. Normally diesel goes back to the tank to cool off. Veggie is the opposite- if it goes round and round, it gets hotter and hotter. I have a red LED on the valve to tell me if it is activated, and on the switch.

Now you can get carbon purge and clean up your engine a bit, it needs to recirc. Also some ATF really cleans out the crap. Next step, add another 3 way as a fuel selector- vegie or normal tank. I use a green LED switch in the cab. So, now you have 2 tanks and a recirc that you need anyhow.

Let's call this phase one. It was hell figuring out wich line was feed and return. Now you need 2 more things- a temp sending unit and a pressure sending unit. I found a glowshift pressure gage that is 0 to 30 PSI! 0 to 100 will not give you enough accuracy and fuel pressure is critical. If it dips below 10 PSI you have a problem, and the truck will slow down or stop, be it veggie or dino. 100 PSI gages seem to die off below 20 PSI
The temp sender is also critical. If you give up on Veggie, none of this will go to waste. I'll chat a bit and then move on to the next phase.

[svoram]

now I'll offer up the whole schematic. First I would get comfortable that your fuel switching system works as it should. When you forget to tighten a clamp, you will have fuel spraying out. You can also see what a it is to change the fuel filter and install the pressure sending unit. The IP pump will beat the hell out of the sending unit, so it needs a needle valve to help isolate it from the pulsation. I also like an electric sending unit but you can run copper line to the cab for a mechanical setup. Once all that works good, you can move on to the coolant (heater) system.

Step 2: SOme veggie kits use electric heaters. It takes a pot of amps to heat fuel. 100 AMPS is barely a start. Personally, I bagged electric heaters. not only do they suck AMPS, they just plain suck. You have plenty of hot radiator fluid to do the trick. Another no-no is a flat plate. They work, but they have to be in the engine compartment as the fuel quickly cools off. No, the trick is a 10 foot long shell and tube heat exchanger. Take a 3/4" heater hose and put aluminum fuel line inside of it. (think I used 3/8) The trick is a 3 way fitting that will isolate the fuel line, then bring in 1/2" heater hose. Now think about it, 50 degree veggie oil is running 10 feet through a tube of 200F coolant, going the other way. By the time it gets to the valves, it's up to temp. Also, in the summer this can help shed some engine heat. My shell and tube cost $100 to make, so now I'm in 300 bucks. I also bought a used, but good 100 gallon tank for 300, so now I'm in $600.

Now you need to be patient and drive around and see if everything is tight. If you wail on the fittings, they will leak. Everything nice and snug but don't overtighten. Then you need to cut the coolant lines to the heater core. On the trip out, make it go to the front of the heat exchanger. Hottest water at the switching valve. Then bring back 10 feet of line to the heater core and engine return. My heater still works great, so I'm feeling good. Again, drive around, check the coolant and smell for the sweet smell of a radiator leak. You may not see it, but you will smell it if you have lots of green stuff in there. If this is all tight, you will be ready for step 3.

[svoram]

well, this forum is a bear to attach photos. I seem to only get 116 kb. I love slapping lots of photos on a post but I may need some education on how I can do that!

[svoram]

for now, here is the link to my website.
Veggie oil truck
wonder if I can link my photos from my web site?

[Broke Down]

if you copy the image location you can post them using the yellow box to attach the pics in

[Broke Down]

[svoram]

let's try some photos. I'll start with the engine recirc and alternate tank lines

[Baja]

It looks like both veg and diesel go through your fuel filter. Yes?

[svoram]

Ah, I must be making progress. Now you need to insulate all the lines with some pipe insulation. The fuel pressure sender is another topic, I mounted mine to the top of the fuel filter. I'm also tempted to remove the fuel filter and mount it elsewhere so I can get to it. The fuel temp is a simple in line sensor and you can add an electric heater. However, I don't like them. To do any good, they have to draw 100 amps plus and it will fry your alternator. You really need a second alternator if you want electric heat for your fuel. Then there is a small relief valve on the fuel return. With the recirc, sometimes you can even boost pressure.
Before shutting off the motor, you must switch back to tank return to purge out all the veggie oil. On a cold day, it will set up like lard and you are screwed until you can warm up the engine. I also has a pressure switch ganged to veggie switch, so if you shut off the motor an alarm goes off reminding you to purge the fuel. SImple, cheap and effective.
so the engine compartment is a pretty simple setup.

[svoram]

Yes, the veggie first goes through the heated Vormax in the back with a 2 micron filter.

The veggie is so clean that the fuel filter is just an extra protection. I'm not a a fan of this little dodge fuel filter, not only is it very hard to service but its also a mediocre filter. I think these Vormax filters are obsolete, but they do kick . However, I like a raycor type with the see through bowl, use the big 2 micron aquablock and wrap the filter in aluminum tubing to heat it. Then cover it in foam and ductape. Veggie oil doesn't give up water as easily as diesel, so the filter also needs to be hot.

I do not use a heated pickup in the tank. If below zero, you must cut it with diesel. If it's too gelled too pick up, it's too cold to use. Also, Veggies are food. If you heat food, it spoils. The tank should not get too hot and must be kept clean. If you like free gas, then you will turn it over every month or 2 and be OK. In the winter, it stays good in the fridge. do not heat the Veggie tank! Also, set some in a glass jar. If it turns to lard in the jar, it's lard in the tank. If it's lard, you need to run dino deisel that day. I'll forgive you, just mix in diesel to unlard it. By spring, you won't have any problem.

Also, do not mix in Gasoline and anything lighter than kerosene! Light ends (like water) flash and cavitate your IP. Kerosene can run a diesel in alaska, you don't need to be stupid and thin your fuel with light ends. it will destroy even a big bad Bosh IP!

[svoram]

so, I have well under $1000 in my system. But think about it, it took 10 tanks of gas just to break even. If you have a greaskit installed you will be in for over 5K. If it works right and doesn't gunk your motor you may even pay for it someday. But if you are not comfortable doing a homemade system, you probably are not able to maintain a veggie car anyhow. The Hybrid Tahoe is slick and more what you need, and you can burn ethanol if we quit making it from corn (good idea, just a stupid grain to make it from)

A few teaching moments- fuel filter is a to change!
Fuel pressure is key. Added extra fuel pump for the veggie tank.
Fuel pressure sending unit dies- need to add a shock absorber, the IP beats it to hell.
Chineese restraunt has cleaner WVO than diesel fuel. Have not had water or plugged a filter yet.
12 volt diesel pump will burn up if you run it for an hour straight. However, harbor frt has a warrantee and just swaps it out! Burn baby burn!

Have lots of plastic 55 gallon drums. You can get fancy, but if you spend too much on assesories you will defeat the entire purpose of a veggie truck. Also, at $5.00 a gallon the economics start to get very interesting. If you fill up weekly, that's $500 a month- now it starts to really make sense. If you fill up monthly, it's probably not worth the trouble at $3.00 a gallon.

No more loaning the truck. I have cleaned it 10 times, fixed broken stuff and I'm all done being Mr nice. Go buy your own truck!

[Baja]

The reason I ask is because with both fuels going through that one filter, to completely purge, you also must also purge the filter. Just makes for a long purge time. I use the Vormax and hose-in-hose method. It works well.