turbo chart

DTanklage · 10-07-2009, 07:36 PM

these are the chargers i would recomment at these power levels

350 hp 56/60/12 or 14

375 56/60/14 non gated

400 60/60/16 non gated

425 60/60/16 or 18 non gated

450 60/60/18 non gated or 62/65/12

475 62/65/14

500 62/65/14 or 64/71/14

550 64/71/14

600 66/71/14

bought my first ctd a little over 5 yrs ago and wanted info about my stock charger. wondered what size it was, if there was something better that came on a different model or year truck, what mods were avail to my charger, and most importantly - what custom chargers were out there

searched and searched read til my eyes bled and was still totally lost. boy was I disappointed. the turbo is a simple part, basically made up from 5 different components: compressor wheel, compressor cover, turbine wheel and exhaust housing. these 4 parts are build on a 'frame' or center section and that is what determines shaft size. what I would like to do is put together a turbo chart for the newbie. I will start it off with what I know to be true, and you guys can add what is needed. remember, plz don’t use info that you have heard to be true...I only want measurements and results that you have seen with your own eyes

turbo chart

(gonna start off with the early stuff because just cuz you bought a 2nd gen it did not necessarily come with the stock charger). not to mention the possiblity of it coming from the factory with the wrong part. dodge is funny like that and so is cummins

everything from 89-93 came with a holeset h1c

89-early91 - 50mm/ 8blade comp wheel, 60mm turbine, 18cm² ex housing
91.5-mid92 - 54mm/ 8blade comp, 60mm turbine, 21cm² ex housing
92.5-93..... same as 91-92, but they went back to the 18cm² ex housing

the early 2nd gen came with a wh1c
early-mid 94 - 54mm 8 blade comp, 60mm turbine, 12cm² WG exhaust housing

in mid 94 cummins switched to the hx-35 holeset
94.5-98 12v 56mm 8 blade comp 60mm turbine 12 cm² ex housing (gated)

somewheres after '98 they switched to a different hx-35, one with a smaller comp wheel
?-2002 54mm 8 blade comp 60mm turbine 12 cm² ex housing

there is also a hx-40. the major dia of the turbine shaft is the same as the hx-35 but it steps down in the middle and is prone to breaking. the good thing about the hx-40 is that one version came with larger comp wheel and cover (the super 40) and because the front part of the shaft is the same size as the hx-35 the wheels are interchangeable.

hx-40 comp wheels:

56mm 8 blade

58mm 8 blade

60mm 6 blade (super 40)

the 40 is avail with 3 different turbines 60,62, and 64mm but because of the weak shaft I advise to run a s-300 or the likes if you end up needing more ex flow than the modified 35 housing or aftermarket units

the stock charger (56/60/12) is good up to approx 300-325 hp. one of the problems with the stock 12 cm² ex housing is that it only gates the front 3 cyls. if the charger is disassembled the divider can be drilled so that all 6 cyls are gated. this reduces drive pressure and egts. if they are still too high there are 14, 16 and 18 cm² non gated aftermarket housings avail.

350 hp 56/60/14

375 56/60/16

400 56 or 60/60/16

425 60/60/16

450 60/60/18

those are about the limits of said chargers. if your goal is higher than 425 hp you should prolly start looking beyond the holeset hybrid. you may want to look into a s-300 based borg warner charger. they work really well on the 12v. the problem with those is no one names them by size, all of the companies came up with their own code words to keep the public confused. (so they did not know what they were buying or that it was marked up 3 or 400 percent)

the s300g is the base model of this charger. it comes in 57/65/14 gated platform. this charger can not be upgraded later as it comes with a smaller backing plate. so its .50 a/r cover and 57mm wheel are all that will work in a 300g

other s-300 comp wheels:

62, 64, 66, and even a larger k-31 71mm wheel can be made to fit. one thing to note about the 62 wheel is that there are 3 diff p/n's avail. std non ett wheel (60#/min), short ett wheel (64#/min), and a tall 62 ett wheel (68#/min). all of the 64 and 66 wheels are of the extended tip tech.

s-300 turbines:

65,68,71,73.5 - the 65 and the 71 are both 11 blade high flow design. the 68 and the 73.5 (commonly called the 74) are 10 blade high drive pressure wheels. they should not be used in a nitrous application

ex housings:

basically the s-300 is shipped with one of two housings: .7 a/r or .8 a/r (12,14cm²). htt makes two different housings, avail only in stainless steel, a 13 cm² and a 16.

you can mix and match all of the above but be careful, you dont want too big of a comp wheel on too small of a turbine, or even worse a small comp wheel that wont move much air on the other end of a big laggy turbine

the crazy code names:

bd chargers -

the super b (300g) (non ett 57 .50 a/r with the high flow 11 blade 65 turbine in a 12cm² cast iron gated housing)

super b special - 64 (ett) .53 a/r with the 11 blade 71 mm turbine in a 14cm² cast iron gated housing).

the gate is adj on the special, its not on the super b

ind inj -they will custom build you a charger but their base models are as follows:

phat shaft - 62/65

super phat shaft - 62/71

silver bullet - 66/73.5

htt -

htb2 - 300 g (same as bd 300g)

street stock 62 - 62/65 same as phat shaft

super street 62 - 62/71 same as super phat shaft

good thing about htt is that they are the only one that came out with their own ex housing. cast in stainless steel it is a beautiful pc. avail in both 13 and 16cm² sizes

htt had some problems with the gate arm bending in their ss housings but that problem has been addressed. be careful when buying used tho

CumminsDriver · 10-07-2009, 08:51 PM

They never made an HX35 with a 60mm turbine wheel.....

__________________
Silver 94 Dodge 2500 4x4 3:55 limited slip. Goerend TC/VB. #0, 4k, 191DV's, 215 injectors, 60/58/9 turbo, 4 inch exhaust

DTanklage · 10-07-2009, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CumminsDriver

They never made an HX35 with a 60mm turbine wheel.....

have you ever tried to measure one that wasnt wore out?

when the bushings wear out and the wheels touch their housings the wheels get smaller

thats when they are supposed to go in the scrap bin eric

heres used turbine #4 with a pair of calipers on it:

okay

it aint exactly 60 mm...

but its close enough for me so i am callin it 60

Last edited by DTanklage : 10-08-2009 at 04:16 AM.

YOUNG GUNS15 · 10-07-2009, 09:09 PM

this is really useful...although some pople put 62/65/14 on almost stock trucks

__________________
94' cummins 12 valve. lots of fuel and a crazy ___ year old

SPECIAL THANKS TO TOXIC DIESEL

DTanklage · 10-07-2009, 09:11 PM

in my experience i have found that the 65 turbine is a little laggy on a underfueled truck

and that it is very restrictive on a heavily fueled truck

*there is also a 68 turbine. it might just bridge the gap between the restrictive 65 and the laggy 71. i have one on order. soon as it gets here i will dyno test drive and edit the chart

Last edited by DTanklage : 10-08-2009 at 04:18 AM.

YOUNG GUNS15 · 10-07-2009, 09:13 PM

i agree, although i havent messed with turbo's as much as you have.... im looking at a 62/65 for my twins setup after i grow out of the hx 35, will the 65 turbine hurt me or O.K in a twins application

__________________
94' cummins 12 valve. lots of fuel and a crazy ___ year old

SPECIAL THANKS TO TOXIC DIESEL

CumminsDriver · 10-07-2009, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DTanklage

have you ever tried to measure one that wasnt wore out?

it is a 11 blade wheel. they are almost impossible to accurately measure with a pair of calipers

I stand corrected. Just went out and measured my old WH1C turbine wheel and got the same measurement. Just a touch under 60mm. I always heard 58mm, and just figured that was what it was. Im sure the one on my 3rd gen charger is the same measurement.

Eric

__________________
Silver 94 Dodge 2500 4x4 3:55 limited slip. Goerend TC/VB. #0, 4k, 191DV's, 215 injectors, 60/58/9 turbo, 4 inch exhaust

dieseltech · 10-07-2009, 10:16 PM

dtanklag...........nice chart looks good to me.... that must of took alot of work to make and type

__________________
07.5 dodge 2500 6.7l cummins 6sp edge hot, mp-8, 2" leveling kit, 35" mtz, home made egr delete plates and shibby sims tester

. 455hp 900tq at the wheels

DTanklage · 10-08-2009, 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOUNG GUNS15

i agree....

im looking at a 62/65 for my twins setup for when i outgrow the hx 35

will the 65 turbine hurt me or [will it be] okay in a twins application?

how much fuel?

what are you gonna use the truck for?

(what is your goal and what is the application?) (lol) (yes, i ask everyone that asks for advice that same question)

when it comes to choosing parts for these trucks you have to take both those things into consideration:

with 5x12's shooting for say 425-450 hp and towing its fine. especially if you put it in a htt housing (the pucks have twice the csa as the cast housing). with 5x14's looking for 500-550 for say drag racing it wont work as well. that wheel just chokes our little motors once you start to throw fuel at it. for a dyno queen it prolly would not be a very good choice either. spools quick but who cares? should not fuel heavy before 1800-2000 anyways. will let you know how much better the 10 blade high drive 68 mm wheel is as soon as i know myself.

i wish someone would make a 10 blade turbine for the s-300 that was not of the high drive design. i think that would work really good for drag racing and sled pulling, might even work on a street truck tow vehicle. 10 blades instead of 11 but with the high flow profile instead of the tight high drive radius

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieseltech

dtanklag...........nice chart looks good to me.... that must of took alot of work to make and type

thanks, i wanted it to go back to '89 so i asked a member for the early sizes. i did copy n paste that part.

Last edited by DTanklage : 10-08-2009 at 04:23 AM.

fatty · 10-08-2009, 01:57 AM

pretty sure 91.5-93 had wh1c

__________________
1991.5 W250

PVXCummins · 10-08-2009, 02:10 AM

Wow, good amounts of info. This should be a sticky so people don't have to search for it. Alot of useful information in one post. Thanks DTanklage!!

__________________
98 4x4 12V, 47RE, Pakbrake Ex. Brake, TQ Lock up, BHAF, 4in to single 5in miter , Boost and EGT gauge, 370 Haisley Injectors, #6 Plate slid, Star wheel turned, Silencer Ring MIA, CB, 305 A/T tires New #'s 10/17/09 323 HP and 700 TQ

***phatboy07*** · 10-08-2009, 02:58 AM

so wat you think my truck would throw done on a dyno at bout 1500ft elevation???

__________________
NEW BUILD UP.... 97 215 Pump
FUEL- 100 Plate FF, 5x14s, 4gsk, 18*
AIR- Volant CAI, 64/71/14, Porting, 4in STR8
Goodies- Studs, O-Rings, Guages, 13" Valair K/C Clutch, Black 7" Mitre

10-07-2009, 07:36 PM	#1 (permalink)
DTanklage Diesel Freak Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: huntington beach Posts: 776 Thanks: 24 Thanked 62 Times in 30 Posts DTanklage's Truck Pics	turbo chart these are the chargers i would recomment at these power levels 350 hp 56/60/12 or 14 375 56/60/14 non gated 400 60/60/16 non gated 425 60/60/16 or 18 non gated 450 60/60/18 non gated or 62/65/12 475 62/65/14 500 62/65/14 or 64/71/14 550 64/71/14 600 66/71/14 bought my first ctd a little over 5 yrs ago and wanted info about my stock charger. wondered what size it was, if there was something better that came on a different model or year truck, what mods were avail to my charger, and most importantly - what custom chargers were out there searched and searched read til my eyes bled and was still totally lost. boy was I disappointed. the turbo is a simple part, basically made up from 5 different components: compressor wheel, compressor cover, turbine wheel and exhaust housing. these 4 parts are build on a 'frame' or center section and that is what determines shaft size. what I would like to do is put together a turbo chart for the newbie. I will start it off with what I know to be true, and you guys can add what is needed. remember, plz don’t use info that you have heard to be true...I only want measurements and results that you have seen with your own eyes turbo chart (gonna start off with the early stuff because just cuz you bought a 2nd gen it did not necessarily come with the stock charger). not to mention the possiblity of it coming from the factory with the wrong part. dodge is funny like that and so is cummins everything from 89-93 came with a holeset h1c 89-early91 - 50mm/ 8blade comp wheel, 60mm turbine, 18cm² ex housing 91.5-mid92 - 54mm/ 8blade comp, 60mm turbine, 21cm² ex housing 92.5-93..... same as 91-92, but they went back to the 18cm² ex housing the early 2nd gen came with a wh1c early-mid 94 - 54mm 8 blade comp, 60mm turbine, 12cm² WG exhaust housing in mid 94 cummins switched to the hx-35 holeset 94.5-98 12v 56mm 8 blade comp 60mm turbine 12 cm² ex housing (gated) somewheres after '98 they switched to a different hx-35, one with a smaller comp wheel ?-2002 54mm 8 blade comp 60mm turbine 12 cm² ex housing there is also a hx-40. the major dia of the turbine shaft is the same as the hx-35 but it steps down in the middle and is prone to breaking. the good thing about the hx-40 is that one version came with larger comp wheel and cover (the super 40) and because the front part of the shaft is the same size as the hx-35 the wheels are interchangeable. hx-40 comp wheels: 56mm 8 blade 58mm 8 blade 60mm 6 blade (super 40) the 40 is avail with 3 different turbines 60,62, and 64mm but because of the weak shaft I advise to run a s-300 or the likes if you end up needing more ex flow than the modified 35 housing or aftermarket units the stock charger (56/60/12) is good up to approx 300-325 hp. one of the problems with the stock 12 cm² ex housing is that it only gates the front 3 cyls. if the charger is disassembled the divider can be drilled so that all 6 cyls are gated. this reduces drive pressure and egts. if they are still too high there are 14, 16 and 18 cm² non gated aftermarket housings avail. 350 hp 56/60/14 375 56/60/16 400 56 or 60/60/16 425 60/60/16 450 60/60/18 those are about the limits of said chargers. if your goal is higher than 425 hp you should prolly start looking beyond the holeset hybrid. you may want to look into a s-300 based borg warner charger. they work really well on the 12v. the problem with those is no one names them by size, all of the companies came up with their own code words to keep the public confused. (so they did not know what they were buying or that it was marked up 3 or 400 percent) the s300g is the base model of this charger. it comes in 57/65/14 gated platform. this charger can not be upgraded later as it comes with a smaller backing plate. so its .50 a/r cover and 57mm wheel are all that will work in a 300g other s-300 comp wheels: 62, 64, 66, and even a larger k-31 71mm wheel can be made to fit. one thing to note about the 62 wheel is that there are 3 diff p/n's avail. std non ett wheel (60#/min), short ett wheel (64#/min), and a tall 62 ett wheel (68#/min). all of the 64 and 66 wheels are of the extended tip tech. s-300 turbines: 65,68,71,73.5 - the 65 and the 71 are both 11 blade high flow design. the 68 and the 73.5 (commonly called the 74) are 10 blade high drive pressure wheels. they should not be used in a nitrous application ex housings: basically the s-300 is shipped with one of two housings: .7 a/r or .8 a/r (12,14cm²). htt makes two different housings, avail only in stainless steel, a 13 cm² and a 16. you can mix and match all of the above but be careful, you dont want too big of a comp wheel on too small of a turbine, or even worse a small comp wheel that wont move much air on the other end of a big laggy turbine the crazy code names: bd chargers - the super b (300g) (non ett 57 .50 a/r with the high flow 11 blade 65 turbine in a 12cm² cast iron gated housing) super b special - 64 (ett) .53 a/r with the 11 blade 71 mm turbine in a 14cm² cast iron gated housing). the gate is adj on the special, its not on the super b ind inj -they will custom build you a charger but their base models are as follows: phat shaft - 62/65 super phat shaft - 62/71 silver bullet - 66/73.5 htt - htb2 - 300 g (same as bd 300g) street stock 62 - 62/65 same as phat shaft super street 62 - 62/71 same as super phat shaft good thing about htt is that they are the only one that came out with their own ex housing. cast in stainless steel it is a beautiful pc. avail in both 13 and 16cm² sizes htt had some problems with the gate arm bending in their ss housings but that problem has been addressed. be careful when buying used tho

10-07-2009, 10:16 PM	#8 (permalink)
dieseltech Cummins Enthusiast Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: omaha,ne Posts: 237 Thanks: 2 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts dieseltech's Truck Pics	dtanklag...........nice chart looks good to me.... that must of took alot of work to make and type __________________ 07.5 dodge 2500 6.7l cummins 6sp edge hot, mp-8, 2" leveling kit, 35" mtz, home made egr delete plates and shibby sims tester. 455hp 900tq at the wheels

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10-07-2009, 08:51 PM	#2 (permalink)
CumminsDriver Diesel Freak Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Lancaster, Ky Posts: 517 Thanks: 2 Thanked 18 Times in 17 Posts CumminsDriver's Truck Pics	They never made an HX35 with a 60mm turbine wheel..... __________________ Silver 94 Dodge 2500 4x4 3:55 limited slip. Goerend TC/VB. #0, 4k, 191DV's, 215 injectors, 60/58/9 turbo, 4 inch exhaust

10-07-2009, 09:09 PM	#4 (permalink)
YOUNG GUNS15 Cummins Nut Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Monticello Utah Posts: 346 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts YOUNG GUNS15's Truck Pics	this is really useful...although some pople put 62/65/14 on almost stock trucks __________________ 94' cummins 12 valve. lots of fuel and a crazy ___ year old SPECIAL THANKS TO TOXIC DIESEL

10-07-2009, 09:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
DTanklage Diesel Freak Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: huntington beach Posts: 776 Thanks: 24 Thanked 62 Times in 30 Posts DTanklage's Truck Pics	in my experience i have found that the 65 turbine is a little laggy on a underfueled truck and that it is very restrictive on a heavily fueled truck there is also a 68 turbine. it might just bridge the gap between the restrictive 65 and the laggy 71. i have one on order. soon as it gets here i will dyno test drive and edit the chart Last edited by DTanklage : 10-08-2009 at 04:18 AM.*

10-07-2009, 09:13 PM	#6 (permalink)
YOUNG GUNS15 Cummins Nut Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Monticello Utah Posts: 346 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts YOUNG GUNS15's Truck Pics	i agree, although i havent messed with turbo's as much as you have.... im looking at a 62/65 for my twins setup after i grow out of the hx 35, will the 65 turbine hurt me or O.K in a twins application __________________ 94' cummins 12 valve. lots of fuel and a crazy ___ year old SPECIAL THANKS TO TOXIC DIESEL

10-08-2009, 01:57 AM	#10 (permalink)
fatty Cummins Fan Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Centerville, WA Posts: 69 Thanks: 5 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post fatty's Truck Pics	pretty sure 91.5-93 had wh1c __________________ 1991.5 W250

10-08-2009, 02:10 AM	#11 (permalink)
PVXCummins Diesel Freak Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Brodheadsville, PA Posts: 593 Thanks: 30 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts PVXCummins's Truck Pics	Wow, good amounts of info. This should be a sticky so people don't have to search for it. Alot of useful information in one post. Thanks DTanklage!! __________________ 98 4x4 12V, 47RE, Pakbrake Ex. Brake, TQ Lock up, BHAF, 4in to single 5in miter , Boost and EGT gauge, 370 Haisley Injectors, #6 Plate slid, Star wheel turned, Silencer Ring MIA, CB, 305 A/T tires New #'s 10/17/09 323 HP and 700 TQ

10-08-2009, 02:58 AM	#12 (permalink)
*phatboy07* Diesel Freak Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: The AZ STaTE Posts: 832 Thanks: 5 Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts phatboy07's Truck Pics	so wat you think my truck would throw done on a dyno at bout 1500ft elevation??? __________________ NEW BUILD UP.... 97 215 Pump FUEL- 100 Plate FF, 5x14s, 4gsk, 18* AIR- Volant CAI, 64/71/14, Porting, 4in STR8 Goodies- Studs, O-Rings, Guages, 13" Valair K/C Clutch, Black 7" Mitre