RecklessJeremy's 2012 build up thread - Page 19 - Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum
4th Gen Performance Parts Discussion Discussion of Performance Parts For the 4th Gen Trucks...NO ADVERTISING

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post #217 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-05-2017, 04:13 PM
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post #218 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 03:46 PM Thread Starter
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Happy Monday fellas!

I'm pleased to report that I believe my fuel pickup issue has been resolved!

I pulled the bed again on Saturday & removed the fuel module from the tank, I went into a dark room & shined a bright light through the module to silhouette the pickup tube in the basket so I could mark right where the bottom of it is & see it on the outside.


Here is the mark that shows where the bottom of the pickup tube was, I set it 1/8" from the bottom of the fuel basket but as you can see its about 3/4" from the actual bottom of the fuel tank, doesn't seem like a lot but apparently that last 1" or so of fuel is 1/8th of a tank according to your fuel gauge.




Here is the new location for the pickup tube collar. There is a small plastic nipple near the bottom of the basket that you can just barely see through the collar in this photo, I had to trim the end off of the nipple so it would clear the pickup tube when I slid it down through the collar.




Bottom of the fuel module before.




Bottom of the fuel module after.
(This was pretty much the only spot where I could make a hole through the bottom of the fuel basket without compromising the pickup screen for the oem pump, it worked out very nicely).




Tube depth set.




Here is how she will sit on the tank floor now.
You can see how closely the oem fuel pickup hugs the bottom of the tank, only about 1/16" or so of clearance (but huge surface area), & that's why it works so well. My pickup tube should be able to access very close to the same amount of fuel as the stock system now before it starts sucking air.




Trying to be as thorough as possible & avoid any chance of having to take the bed off for a third time, I decided to put some fuel safe gasket maker where the flexible plastic tube would slide onto the metal pickup tube & bulkhead nipple... This was probably just paranoia getting the best of me but I wanted to be certain that no air would have any chance of getting pulled in anywhere on the suction side of the pump. If you do this, make sure you don't get any of this stuff down inside the tube, and wipe off any excess that's left after you slide the flex tube on.









This is kind of nit-picky, but I figured I'd go ahead & mention the one thing I don't really like about these FASS bulkheads.
They are machined to where the return port is just a hole without a nipple (see photo above), so the fuel that is returned from the Fuelab pump falls from the top of the tank & could potentially introduce a lot of foam & bubbles that could get sucked back into the pump depending on your suction tube setup & proximity to the bulkhead, pump speed, fuel level, etc.
It seems like they could put a nipple on the bottom of the return hole just like they have on the pickup hole, that way you could at least have the option of running a flexible hose (like the pickup hose) down to the bottom of the tank so you don't stir up so much air into the fuel. This video helps explain the benefits of having your return line output below the fuel level in the tank.


Going back in with the module, I decided to connect the flex hose to the bulkhead first like they do in the instructions, then to the pickup tube as the basket goes in the tank hole....
Definitely easier than the first time! Lol


All done.




I turned the key on & heard the pump prime almost instantly, she banged right over with no issues & the rail pressure was steady as can be @ 6k. I drove it around town with no issues until the fuel light came on, then put another 20+ miles on it just to see what would happen... No issues while driving, no issues starting, & doesn't seem to have any fuel slosh issues either, even with the fuel light on. I'm temped to see how long I can go until it starts sucking air again, but 20-30 miles after the fuel light comes on should be plenty of wiggle room for those "oops" incidents where you forget to fuel up & the next fuel station is in the next town down the road, lol.

So that's a winner in my book! On to the next...


Side note:
Here's a quick tip for anyone pulling truck beds at home, I decided to use both a tension buckle style strap & a ratchet strap on all four corners. I made a small loop out of the tension straps, & hooked the ratchet straps to them, the ratchet straps work great for getting the bed up off the truck, & the tension buckle straps work great for slowly lowering the bed back down... Might not be the best way to do it, but it worked good for me. A lot better than using one style or the other by itself.


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post #219 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 03:47 PM Thread Starter
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Beautiful Build. Thankyou for sharing.
Thanks Buddy!

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post #220 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 02:48 PM Thread Starter
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Well I decided to finally tackle the Twin Fueler kit on Saturday, everything went pretty well, I decided to just buy a Husky locking flex-head ratchet & a 6 point 27mm socket instead of that special tool that I'd probably never use again.

I did have to remove the #5 & #6 injector lines so I could get the rear lift bracket out of the way. The nut part of the fuel pressure sensor is very short, and the socket just felt really wobbly when I put it on, I decided to trim the end of the socket off for better engagement on the nut, & also free up a little bit more room for the ratchet. (I wasn't able to find a 27mm socket with 3/8" drive, so I had to use a 3/8" to 1/2" adapter which added length to the tool assembly).


Before.




After.




The sacrificial piece.




It felt better & quite a bit more secure with full 360 degree contact on the nut now.

I wasn't able to break the sensor loose from the top, so I left the socket / ratchet in place & crawled under the truck & was able to get it by pulling from the bottom.


This is how I had the ratchet set.




Anyway, everything went pretty smoothly after that for the most part, its pretty straight forward, just follow the instructions that come with the kit, they are adequate.

Saturday went good, I got everything done to the point where all I would have to do Sunday morning is route the new belt (in the daylight) and hook up the electronics, which is super simple... But here's where things came to a screeching halt.

I know these belts end up being tight, like really freakin' tight. Pretty much all Dual CP3 kits are like that from what I hear, but this belt just wasn't going on, like there was no chance of it going on at all. It looked like the belt needed to be 1" or more longer to ever have a chance of going over the ATS idler pulley. (The new idler that comes with the kit & mounts to the pump bracket should be the last pulley to slip the belt over while you have the tensioner fully maxed out).

I searched the part number on the belt to make sure I had the right one, K081377HD 138.25" that is indeed the correct one.

I had noticed as soon as I installed the main bracket/CP3 that the top of the new pulley was leaning back towards the engine, I had seen the propaganda video on YouTube about the redesigned kit & how they built some flex into the bracket this time around to eliminate the problem they had with the brackets cracking on the original design, so I figured this was normal & that once the belt was on & tightened up it would straighten the pulley out.... Guess I was wrong.

Apparently several other people had the same pulley misalignment issues to varying degrees with early productions of the redesigned kit, and as you might expect there were several nasty problems caused by it, sheering off idler pulleys, eating up belts like crazy, belts causing all kinds of carnage when they came apart, broken fans, fan clutches, water pumps even radiator damage..... Not something I wanna join in on.


In hindsight there were a couple of other small issues I ran into that I believe were caused by the pump leaning back towards the motor, for one thing the new CP3 & fittings come VERY close to the OEM intake horn, particularly in the throttle valve area, I'm putting a new intake horn on the top of my list now to hopefully free up a little more room, I don't like the angle my supply hose has to enter the CP3 fitting presently.
And secondly, the new hard line that goes between the CP3 & fuel pressure sensor / junction block seemed like it was a little too long, I had to bow it pretty good to get it popped into place between the CP3 & junction block.


Just so no one thinks I'm crazy or cross-eyed, I took some pictures with a straight edge across the alternator pulley and the OEM idler pulley (top/center pulley), they were perfectly aligned no surprise, the pipe laid perfectly flat across both sides of both pulleys, but once you follow the straight edge out to the top of the new CP3 pulley, its off by 3/8" ! (Gap is only about 1/16" at bottom of new pulley).

(The straight edge I used was just a piece of 1" square tubing, I have a framing square but it was too big to fit between the fan & pulleys, so I used the square to make sure the length of tubing was good & straight).


Here's the photos.










I called ATS this morning & they agreed to send me a new bracket so we will see how that goes, if its still not aligned properly with the new bracket then I will modify it myself as needed to make the pulleys line up right & the belt fit correctly.


Its gonna sit a little lower than I expected, should look pretty good & subtle enough when its all said & done, excuse the filthy engine bay.






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post #221 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 04:36 PM
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Very cool, Great pictures and detailed steps. Hope the new brackets solves the problem
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post #222 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 09:36 PM
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To install the belt on my truck I take both alternator bolts out and sink the alternator into the bracket, install the belt and use a pry bar to push the alternator back out to install the mounting bolts. Kind of a pia, but it's the only way I could get it on there. The belt is definitely a tight fit.

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post #223 of 230 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 09:05 AM Thread Starter
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To install the belt on my truck I take both alternator bolts out and sink the alternator into the bracket, install the belt and use a pry bar to push the alternator back out to install the mounting bolts. Kind of a pia, but it's the only way I could get it on there. The belt is definitely a tight fit.

Thanks for the tip once again man, I'll probably do it that way as well... How is your pulley alignment? Pretty good?

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post #224 of 230 (permalink) Old 02-02-2017, 02:07 AM
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My pulley alignment was good right out of the box. Sorry to hear your having problems with that. Hopefully the replacement bracket from ats straightens that out for ya.

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post #225 of 230 (permalink) Old 02-07-2017, 01:44 PM Thread Starter
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Well I called ATS on Monday, had a new bracket in my hands on Thursday... So I was able to to pull the old bracket out & swap everything over to the new one on Saturday.
I was less than thrilled to find that the new bracket had an ugly little crack in it already right out of the box, in the corner of one of the bends.








I was tempted to send it back for another but I really wanted to get the truck going again over the weekend so I just ground the crack down & welded it up, I forgot to get an after picture, but we basically just welded that whole gap up straight across the relief cut & shot a new coat of paint on it.




Here's a quick tip for torquing the CP3 wheel to the pump shaft (ATS tells you to torque the nut to 52 ft/lbs, but they don't tell you the best way to accomplish this). I put two of the three bolts in that hold the pump to the bracket, torqued them to spec (35 ft/lbs) and then used the third hole temporarily to help torque the pulley nut to 60 ft/lbs (went a little overboard) lol. My 1/4" extension fit perfectly in the bolt hole, & kept the pulley from spinning while I torqued it down.




(I've also heard that you can just get it hand tight on the bench & then once its all installed & the belt is on, the belt will hold it from spinning well enough while you put the final torque on it.)


Anyway, we got everything put back on by Saturday afternoon & I was relieved to find that the pulley alignment was pretty much dead on perfect now with the new bracket.




Side note: I borrowed this picture from another Forum where they were talking about the same thing (pulley misalignment), I added the blue lines to show where I put my straight edge to check my alignment, just in case I didn't explain it well enough in my last post.




Even with the new bracket we still weren't able to get the belt on the right way, I had to do it the way C37 suggested & use the alternator as a secondary tensioner basically, I took the top bolt out & loosened up the bottom bolt & let the alternator pivot towards the motor so the belt would slide on.... But then you gotta get the alternator pulled back out & the bolt holes lined back up which becomes the new struggle. Lol

Apparently there is no belt available that is just 0.5" or 1" longer than the one I've got, so I'm probably going to look into getting a smaller idler pulley to replace either the new one that comes with the ATS kit, or the oem one... I think people are using Gates part # 38052 in place of the oem idler pulley to free up a little wiggle room, the tensioner is basically maxed out right now doing nothing, & I don't like that... No way that's good on your accessory bearings & whatnot, I see them wearing out much sooner than usual.


Anyway, we got everything back together & took it for a spin, no leaks, rail pressure seems to be acting normal, no high pressure at startup & no erratic behavior while driving, everything is acting like it should, so no issues with the controller it seems.
I've heard people say that their trucks run smoother & just better overall with the second CP3 added, even if you don't necessarily need it... Not sure if its just my imagination but I would have to say that I agree with that statement as well.

Sunday morning I decided to go ahead & load up the max effort (for stock injectors) tune that I had waiting for me from Anarchy .
Once again, super smooth, no issues, was a lot less smokey than I was afraid it would be, had to double check that I had the right tune loaded up, lol. I took the RPM up pretty high a few times to see if the belt would fly off lol, pegged out the rail pressure to 24k several times & maxed out the oem boost sensor more than once as well, I'd say all is well.

The new bracket freed up a little more space between the pump & the intake horn as well, the picture below is a little bit deceiving because the left photo wasn't taken very straight, but you can still tell there is 1/4" to 3/8" more room now.




It would work fine as is for years to come, but I still want to get that supply hose off the throttle valve, rather than waste $80 on a throttle valve delete I decided to just go ahead & finally upgrade the intake horn itself.

I usually recommend the GDP intake horn, & its still one of my favorites for sure. but I decided to go with the BD Diesel intake for my own truck & here's why.

1. Fitment. I really like the simple, fabricated tubing look of the Pusher intake, but I highly doubt it would fit, I wasn't able to get an answer from Pusher or ATS, and I know others have had fitment issues with Pusher.... So I took that one off the table. I know the BD intake fits thanks to this DPP listing for the ATS kit.

2. Optional Grid Heater. GDP is the only other intake I know of that has this option, but it takes the place of the throttle valve, so if you wanted the option of a grid heater with your GDP intake, you'd have to buy the S-2 intake for about $370, and then the high flow heater for an additional $330. I don't plan on running a grid heater at all, I live in Texas & I've been fine without one for years, but I do like having the option, just in case I end up somewhere that actually gets legit cold, or if I run into cold start issues after I get my injectors done, etc.
The BD intake has a threaded port in the side that's plugged by default, but if you decide you want a grid heater you just buy this handy little $95 heater coil & screw it in that port & connect your wiring & bam! Grid heater.

3. Six bolt design without sacrificing flow area. A lot of aftermarket intakes (GDP included) are a five bolt design, they eliminate the middle/outside bolt so that they can have maximum flow area through the middle, the BD intake has a hole in the top so you can install the bolt from inside the intake & use all six bolts without sacrificing the flow area that you would with a bolt boss that runs to the top/outside of the intake (careful not to drop the bolt down into the shelf! Lol). This isn't a big deal IMO, and not a BD exclusive by any means, I know the AFE Blade Runner intake & a few others do the same thing, but it just seems more secure than a five bolt design. (Although having the bolt head inside the intake opens up the possibility of having a boost leak right there, or the even worse possibility of the bolt backing out & getting sucked into the motor... That would be a bad, bad day, lol). Its also worth mentioning that the GDP intakes do have a little stud cast into them that goes through the bolt hole in the gasket & down into the bolt hole in the intake shelf, doesn't add any clamping force, but should help the gasket from blowing out right there.

4. Price. I've already mentioned that the GDP S-2 intake + high flow heater would cost you about $700, and you'd still have the stock cold side boost tube (between the intercooler & intake horn). The BD intake for $395 comes with a new 3.5" boost tube & once you add the optional Heater Kit (Part# 1041563) for $95 you're looking at $490 all said & done, plus the fact that I had a $50 discount code for Summit Racing, it was a no brainer for me, lol. (Again, not bashing GDP in any way, just explaining my reasons for going with BD after preaching GDP for so long!) The intake is in the mail so I should be able to slap in on this weekend, I'll take some pics when I'm done.






Anyway, the truck feels good! I'm a happy camper, cant wait to get the injectors done & see what this baby can really do!

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post #226 of 230 (permalink) Old 02-07-2017, 06:13 PM
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Looks good! Thats the intake Im planning on buying when I have a few extra bucks kicking around.

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post #227 of 230 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 01:14 PM Thread Starter
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Looks good! Thats the intake Im planning on buying when I have a few extra bucks kicking around.
Twinning!!




Got the intake installed after work yesterday, no issues
If you take all the bolts out of your intake & it still doesn't want to come out, you probably forgot the bolt that's in the back side holding some bundle of wires to the intake horn... I always forget about that dang thing. Here's a pic of it.




Here's another picture of the little bracket the bolt runs through, its connected to the wiring with a zip tie so I just cut it off so it wont sit there & rattle against the new CP3 hard line, it wont be used anymore with the new intake.




I don't think I ever showed where I put the CP3 controller, so here it is... There's a nice little nook on the front of the fuse box, fits nicely I think.




New Vs. old boost tubes.... Pic is a little deceiving because the new tube is a little higher than the old one, still a nice increase in ID & smoothness. (Check out that big sharp lip on the old plastic tube, turbulence city!)




New Vs. old intake horn outlets... Speaks for itself.




Fuel supply line for new CP3 is no longer in a bind, not really touching anything at all anymore.




Its close! But definitely fits without issue.



I've got a little bit of an issue with erratic coolant temps, its quickly jumping all over the place from 198 to 208, no relation to RPM or EGTs or engine load or anything like that... Seems like some air got introduced into the system when I put the new upper radiator hose on. The new hose is right at about the same height as my bleeder, so that's probably why there's still some air in the system even after I bled it the usual way. I might pull the passenger side front wheel up on a ramp just to give it that little bit of extra elevation on the radiator cap / bleeder side, & keep any air from getting trapped in the new hose over on the drivers side.

Sunday morning I'm taking the truck & a 20' bumper pull trailer to go pick up a Dodge Durango that's having some transmission issues, it'll be about a 1000 mile round trip so we will see how it all goes. Its not a heavy load by any means, but I'm still putting the old set of tunes back on the MM before I pull anything, lol.

Oh! I got a $180 Invoice from ATS the other day as well, for the replacement bracket.... It went straight to the paper shredder.
If they send me another I'll call them up & see who's smoking crack over there.



Anyway, that's about it for now!
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post #228 of 230 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 05:18 PM
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Twinning!!









Got the intake installed after work yesterday, no issues

If you take all the bolts out of your intake & it still doesn't want to come out, you probably forgot the bolt that's in the back side holding some bundle of wires to the intake horn... I always forget about that dang thing. Here's a pic of it.









Here's another picture of the little bracket the bolt runs through, its connected to the wiring with a zip tie so I just cut it off so it wont sit there & rattle against the new CP3 hard line, it wont be used anymore with the new intake.









I don't think I ever showed where I put the CP3 controller, so here it is... There's a nice little nook on the front of the fuse box, fits nicely I think.









New Vs. old boost tubes.... Pic is a little deceiving because the new tube is a little higher than the old one, still a nice increase in ID & smoothness. (Check out that big sharp lip on the old plastic tube, turbulence city!)









New Vs. old intake horn outlets... Speaks for itself.









Fuel supply line for new CP3 is no longer in a bind, not really touching anything at all anymore.









Its close! But definitely fits without issue.







I've got a little bit of an issue with erratic coolant temps, its quickly jumping all over the place from 198 to 208, no relation to RPM or EGTs or engine load or anything like that... Seems like some air got introduced into the system when I put the new upper radiator hose on. The new hose is right at about the same height as my bleeder, so that's probably why there's still some air in the system even after I bled it the usual way. I might pull the passenger side front wheel up on a ramp just to give it that little bit of extra elevation on the radiator cap / bleeder side, & keep any air from getting trapped in the new hose over on the drivers side.



Sunday morning I'm taking the truck & a 20' bumper pull trailer to go pick up a Dodge Durango that's having some transmission issues, it'll be about a 1000 mile round trip so we will see how it all goes. Its not a heavy load by any means, but I'm still putting the old set of tunes back on the MM before I pull anything, lol.



Oh! I got a $180 Invoice from ATS the other day as well, for the replacement bracket.... It went straight to the paper shredder.

If they send me another I'll call them up & see who's smoking crack over there.







Anyway, that's about it for now!


For a cracked replacement at that


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