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Old 12-21-2010, 07:10 PM   #1 (permalink)
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I6 vs V8

The new cummins are really starting to throw me off. For years, I was told that I6 was a better configuration in almost every way. I did research, and I was sure they were. Less cylinders = less parts, less complicated, etc. I thought that they had a longer crank throw which means more torque, and lower rev torque, which equals better MPG. But now the 5.0 is being developed for 1500 trucks. I don't know what to think...
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Old 12-21-2010, 07:17 PM   #2 (permalink)
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The new cummins are really starting to throw me off. For years, I was told that I6 was a better configuration in almost every way. I did research, and I was sure they were. Less cylinders = less parts, less complicated, etc. I thought that they had a longer crank throw which means more torque, and lower rev torque, which equals better MPG. But now the 5.0 is being developed for 1500 trucks. I don't know what to think...
well ford was supposed to come out with a half ton diesel option but the idea was scrapped when the auto maker hit hard times! but maybeeee the v-8 diesel was designed for the improved fuel economy? Cummins is so well known for the I6 it is puzzling that there is talk of the 5.0 v8...
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Old 12-21-2010, 07:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
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i have also heard that that 5.0 v8 was going to be an option in the jeep line as well! but that is just what i've heard!
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Old 12-21-2010, 07:37 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Makes perfect sense to me. The 1500 isn't going to be hauling anywhere near the weight the 25/3500 trucks will. And the driving characteristics between the I6 and V6/8 (both are developed and ready to go)...which is more gasser-like? The V configuration. And who is the 1500 diesel aimed at? Exactly, former gasser owners.

Also, look at NVH. An inline, by nature, shakes a bit more. Are people going to want the added vibration of an inline-4 or -6 in the 1500, or are they going to want a more smooth platform of the V?

Everyone cries because it's not going to be a smaller displacement I6 or even an I4 like the ISB4.5, but it just doesn't make sense. The V8 makes perfect sense.

I say well done Cummins. Now we just need these things cranked out and available for purchase. And let's do it BEFORE GM or Ford
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Old 12-21-2010, 07:41 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Makes perfect sense to me. The 1500 isn't going to be hauling anywhere near the weight the 25/3500 trucks will. And the driving characteristics between the I6 and V6/8 (both are developed and ready to go)...which is more gasser-like? The V configuration. And who is the 1500 diesel aimed at? Exactly, former gasser owners.

Also, look at NVH. An inline, by nature, shakes a bit more. Are people going to want the added vibration of an inline-4 or -6 in the 1500, or are they going to want a more smooth platform of the V?

Everyone cries because it's not going to be a smaller displacement I6 or even an I4 like the ISB4.5, but it just doesn't make sense. The V8 makes perfect sense.

I say well done Cummins. Now we just need these things cranked out and available for purchase. And let's do it BEFORE GM or Ford
the "ballance" of the V8 makes good sense.... and with the upcomming fuel economy reg set in motion by the government of 26 avg. fleet mpg that is a good way to go!
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Old 12-21-2010, 08:32 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm just not sure why 1500 owners would need a 5.0L. Why not a 4.0L? For stock truck folks, unless it was getting 25mpg highway at least, it wouldn't be worth it.

Then again for Hemi owners, anything better than 12mpg would probably take the win.
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Old 12-21-2010, 08:35 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I'm just not sure why 1500 owners would need a 5.0L. Why not a 4.0L? For stock truck folks, unless it was getting 25mpg highway at least, it wouldn't be worth it.

Then again for Hemi owners, anything better than 12mpg would probably take the win.
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Old 12-22-2010, 02:00 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I'm just not sure why 1500 owners would need a 5.0L. Why not a 4.0L?
Well, using that logic, why use a 4.0L and not a 3.0L?

I would imagine there is a reason the Cummins engineers went with a 5.0...good middle-of-the-road displacement maybe? Not too big, but not too small. Too small and it's down on power. Too big, your going head-to-head with the 6.6 and 6.7 V8s in the heavy duty segment with a halfton.

Now if it were slated to be a 6.0L, everyone would be saying "why a 6.0L and not a 5.0L?"

Keep in mind, this is still a pickup. It is not designed or meant to get amazing, TDI-fighting mileage. It's meant to get better mileage, and probably longer life-cycle, and more power than a comparable gas engine. Better mileage than a gasser, yet still have the ability to pull a smaller camper or whatever on the weekend.

And then there are the rumors of it being available as an alternative to the I6 in the 2500........now a 4.0L sure as ain't gonna cut it in a 3/4 ton pickup now is it? (not that the V8 will for sure be available, but I'd get one if it were...)
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Old 12-22-2010, 02:50 AM   #9 (permalink)
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What is the 5.0 going to be rated at? I think a 4.0 sounds more logical to me. Most average joes are going to look at numbers so unless its far off from the 6.7 some guys might say why buy a 2500/3500, even though theres more to it that that. I mean whats the average 1/2 ton gas motor put out these day 300+ hp and 350+ tq i say build something to match or beet those numbers by a little like 250hp and 450tq I dont know what size motor would be better suited for that but i guess if they do that the 5.0 if it wasnt working so hard it wuold last longer. IDk this has me interested im subbing
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Old 12-22-2010, 11:02 AM   #10 (permalink)
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There isnt a damn thing wrong with a V8 diesel, the duramaxes and 7.3L PS's have proven that.
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Old 12-22-2010, 11:08 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Well, using that logic, why use a 4.0L and not a 3.0L?

I would imagine there is a reason the Cummins engineers went with a 5.0...good middle-of-the-road displacement maybe? Not too big, but not too small. Too small and it's down on power. Too big, your going head-to-head with the 6.6 and 6.7 V8s in the heavy duty segment with a halfton.

Now if it were slated to be a 6.0L, everyone would be saying "why a 6.0L and not a 5.0L?"

Keep in mind, this is still a pickup. It is not designed or meant to get amazing, TDI-fighting mileage. It's meant to get better mileage, and probably longer life-cycle, and more power than a comparable gas engine. Better mileage than a gasser, yet still have the ability to pull a smaller camper or whatever on the weekend.

And then there are the rumors of it being available as an alternative to the I6 in the 2500........now a 4.0L sure as ain't gonna cut it in a 3/4 ton pickup now is it? (not that the V8 will for sure be available, but I'd get one if it were...)
They should have just used the 3.0L V6 diesel from the 2007+ sprinter vans. If its good enough for a 1 ton commerical van its good enough for a 1/2 ton pickup.

Or maybe had two diesel options the 2.7 or 3.0 fuel sipper or the 5.0L muscle bound goon.

However they probably wanted a truck that is nearly as quick as a HEMI.
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Old 12-22-2010, 11:10 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I'm not sure I agree that a V8 is better balanced than in I6. My Duramax would make my butt numb while I sat in the cab idling. Not so with the I6.

An inline six engine is in perfect primary and secondary mechanical balance, which can be achieved without using a balance shaft. The engine is in primary balance because the front and rear trio of cylinders are mirror images, and the pistons move in pairs. That is, piston #1 balances #6, #2 balances #5, and #3 balances #4, largely eliminating the polar rocking motion that would otherwise result. Secondary imbalance is avoided because an inline six cylinder crankshaft has six crank throws arranged in three planes offset at 120°. The result is that differences in piston speed at any given point in rotation are effectively canceled.
An inline four cylinder or V6 engine without a balance shaft will experience secondary dynamic imbalance, resulting in engine vibration. As a general rule, the forces arising from any dynamic imbalance increase as the square of the engine speed — that is, if the speed doubles, vibration will increase by a factor of four. In contrast, inline six engines have no primary or secondary imbalances, and with carefully designed crankshaft vibration dampers to absorb torsional vibration, will run more smoothly at the same crankshaft speed (rpm). This characteristic has made the inline six popular in some European sports-luxury cars, where smooth high-speed performance and good fuel economy are desirable. As engine reciprocating forces increase with the cube of piston mass, inline six is a preferred configuration for large truck engines.[6]
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